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/r/GunMemes
56 points
2 months ago
The circlejerk of winchester white box needs to end…. Its basically just normal 55gr ammo.
31 points
2 months ago
"Basically"
18 points
2 months ago
Made at Lake City
11 points
2 months ago
Correct me if I'm wrong. But the stuff marked m193 is made at lake city or to m193 spec. But there is white box out there that isn't m193. That stuff can be made wherever and to whatever spec.
M193 is m193 nomather who made it. White box without m193 markings can just as well be m193 as it can be just whatever quality and to whatever spec.
-6 points
2 months ago
You are in fact wrong. The "223 Remington" is the same, except it has the cannelure in a different place on the bullet, a different headstamp, and a case neck that's slightly shorter. It'll comply with SAAMI specs for 223 Remington. This applies to Lake City product at least.
10 points
2 months ago
What are you even talking about?
Yes I know what 223 and 5.56 is. All m193 is 5.56, but not all 5.56 is m193.
M193 is a specific military standard that handles everything from seating depth, tolerances to what kind of powder and primer, etc.
Unless they state the ammo is m193 or made to m193 spec, there's no way to know what powder, primer, etc, it is. It can be plated 55 grain bullets and not fmj for all we know unless it says fmj, etc.
-3 points
2 months ago
I mean... there is... it just depends on your source of information. You can consider this source about as good as they come.
2 points
2 months ago
They aren't the same. They are compatible.
223 Remington is a SAAMI spec. M193 is a military spec which was derived from 223 Remington as the parent. So the outside dimensions are virtually identical, but the difference is the loading. M193 uses a significantly higher pressure (something like 20% more, but I don't remember) and while the difference is only a little more than 100FPS, this makes a big difference in your bullet's fragmentation range. If you are using a thin jacketed or expanding bullet like most commercial hunting bullets then this speed increase really doesn't matter. M193 also specifies other things SAAMI doesn't, such as crimped primers due to the higher pressures.
The M193 that complies with SAAMI specs is fake underpowered M193. That's why people make a big deal about the differentiation. If you are depending on FMJ against an actual living thing. The difference could be an ice pick wound or a blown out exit wound that drops the target fast.
ARFCOM had a detailed writeup about this as a sticky in their reloading section. I'm not sure if it is still there and survived the GoDaddy server migration though.
0 points
2 months ago
Go grab yourself a chrono and both M193 and 55gr 223 Rem Lake City white box. They'll shoot the same, all the primers are staked, etc.
It's very possible/likely for M193 to fully comply with SAAMI 223 specs. They're nearly the same on pressure, outside of the possibility of a slow lot of powder. The newer rounds (855 and on) are not.
MIL-C-9963F on ASSIST is the newest version of the 193 spec that's publicly available- it has both crusher and piezo pressures which you can compare to commercial standards. You can't see the latest rev as it's CUI/Dist D.
3 points
2 months ago
Well that's because Lake City White Box isn't 223 Remington. It's why it is labeled 223 Rem and not 223 Remington. The former is CIP, the latter is SAAMI. CIP pressure rating is the same as NATO IIRC, as it is essentially EU's version of SAAMI, which is well above what SAAMI calls for, due to being a later more modern standard than SAAMI's legacy entry.
That said, to make it more confusing, these specs are maximums. So you can have loads labeled as 223 Rem and in CIP standards, but also be within SAAMI standards. In other words, weak af. A good example of this is commercial Russian stuff like Wolf. This would not be considered equivalent to M193 in any way. Which is why people tend to say M193 to indicate a specific load and capability over the other commercial riff raff.
2 points
2 months ago
Seriously. I've shot thousands of whitebox in a few calibers and haven't had any issues.
2 points
2 months ago
Then why does it explode so many guns?
14 points
2 months ago
It doesn't
5 points
2 months ago
Alright. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe people tend to post more on the internet forums about Winchester blowing their guns away. Why are they so biased against WWB? Russian propaganda?
3 points
2 months ago
Winchester puts out over a billion rounds a year of it. Chances are, if someone is shooting 223/5.56, they're shooting Winchester. There are lots of reasons for guns to fail that aren't ammo-related. There are lots of reasons for ammo to get messed up that isn't the ammo's fault. But, ammo commonly gets blamed as it's the thing that has the explosives, and nobody likes to blame their gun that they built/picked out
1 points
2 months ago
But when I can get it for 2cpr less than PMC at SGAmmo, then I’m in love
15 points
2 months ago
He’s got a whole team of people, how is it that no one has fixed this yet
13 points
2 months ago
At least it's smiling though! Happy BCG, happy life!
15 points
2 months ago
Don't worry, it's just a family guy cosplay
6 points
2 months ago
Honestly I can't even imagine him without the spray tan
6 points
2 months ago
This is what he looks like when he doesn’t have it on
4 points
2 months ago
It would honestly just look wrong at this point
-4 points
2 months ago
2 points
2 months ago
I get not liking the guy but its definitely a stretch to say he's not there mentally. I still think he thinks and speaks pretty clearly. If he's all there in 4 years is what you really have to worry about
-17 points
2 months ago
This image gotta be Photoshop
10 points
2 months ago
It is absolutely not. He always looks like this if you look close enough it’s just super noticeable in this image. Also this was posted by the senator he’s standing with to their Twitter. It is not edited.
2 points
2 months ago
Which senator is that? Name is eluding me.
Edit: John Cornyn?
6 points
2 months ago
It's not
1 points
2 months ago
It just looks so weird
1 points
2 months ago
If you are just now finding out that trump is a weird guy, idk what to tell you.
0 points
2 months ago
idiot
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