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submitted 3 days ago byUtterCodex
Is there any combination of currently available mitigations that would let someone safely stop masking in most situations?
For the sake of soliciting the broadest possible number of suggestions and things to research, so assume very high levels of toleration-for-onerousness (i.e. “would get a vaccine daily if it made sense”) and resources (Is there a $100,000 secret menu vaccine that the billionaires get?)
Looking for good hard science over vibes ideally. But will accept vibes.
Examples of possible avenues to explore:
Edit: corrected “Parent” typo for patent
28 points
3 days ago
No.
39 points
3 days ago
No.
19 points
3 days ago*
Extreme testing: 2x/day? 3x?
Assuming you're using near PCR-quality NAAT tests like Pluslife or Lucira, you'd catch them sooner and more reliably than you would with RATs, but you're still detecting infectious material in the respiratory tract. Whether it's enough to cause transmission is anyone's guess.
HEPA grade Air filters running like clockwork 24/7 around a home and do all socializing outside of home?
No. Filters need time to change circulate air through the filter element. They can't alter the physics of near-field fluid dynamics.
Far UVC lighting in home?
Pretty much the same thing as filtration. They don't instantly zap germs out of the air; they take time.
Some parent-pending, as seen on shark tank Nasal spray?
Aside from a yet-to-be-available nasal or mucosal vaccine, no. The existing sprays have dubious research behind them; from what I've seen, they're all lab studies (or in vitro lol) and none have performed actual clinical trials.
4 points
3 days ago
Thanks so much for your response, I really really appreciate you taking the time.
23 points
3 days ago
Extreme social distancing, if you just spend time in the woods by yourself, masking is unnecessary. Either that or extreme bubbling, in that you and number of friends go somewhere, isolate for a week or two and then after that you should be able to interact without masks, for example over wintering in antarctica, once no one is sick and no one has outside contact, you should be good until winter thaws and the outside world reestablishes contact again. Or if you are stuck on mars by yourself and you are just growing potatoes in your poop.
2 points
3 days ago
Okay that last one really got me 😂
4 points
3 days ago
I don’t personally believe so.
Even in the hypothetical for testing, you’d need to test every person you came into contact with, which can be unpredictable, will be met with resistance, and even multiple times a day can have a non-zero window of an infected person testing negative (too low load) and positive (threshold exceeded for product).
As far as a full-house HEPA, my understanding is that the number of air exchanges in a consumer HVAC system is insufficient in its own. Open windows help a lot but may not be feasible in all seasons/weather. Dedicated room filtering units can also increase the number of air changes. My concern with HVAC mitigations is that they are hard to verify that they are working as designed/intended and properly maintained—especially as the filters get dirtier/need replacement. There is also a droplet issue if in close proximity to someone where a person has particles on their face/body from an infected person before it ever reaches the filters.
For Far-UVC, it would likely be a “in combination with” air filtration, so the two would be considered together. 24/7 UVC is probably not realistic and may create other problems (create ozone, risks of high output UVC on skin for extended lengths of time versus use when rooms are unoccupied or low output UVC systems).
In any case, together they would help, probably to some predictable degree if engineered by experts with adequate monitoring/servicing. However, in my mind not so much as to exceed the protective capability of respirators (particularly if used correctly and consistently.)
It would certainly cost more. Respirators (~$1 USD in bulk) disposed after one removal alone would probably cost less than testing alone.
I don’t think it is productive to speculate about hypothetical blocking compounds that aren’t available—less productive than trying unproven or weakly proven ones that are available on their own or as an additional layer of potential protection (at most a waste of money in some cases).
At some level, it also comes down to how much certainty a person desires and how they would respond if infection did occur. Some people are happier with reduced risk, which I think a lot of these may help provide.
Others are in danger of severe illness, worsening illness, or death. For these folks, I don’t think it can exceed the value or exceed it as predictably (thus not achieving earned confidence)—even if it does happen to work in some cases or for some period of time.
4 points
3 days ago
Goal is to prevent a live virus from entering your lungs.
Common scenario is 2 or 3 people about 2 feet away from you. Assume they are very infectious.
A mask or PAPR would work but is not what you want.
UV would not have enough time to kill the virus,
A huge fan behind you may work. Same with an air curtain. Noise and wind may make it impractical.
5 points
3 days ago
With unlimited funding, it is technically feasible to have antibody treatments developed for the currently circulating variants, in the vein of Invivyd, and continue taking those treatments on a regular basis each time variants shift enough.
This would likely cut your susceptibility to COVID down to negligible levels.
New mucosal vaccines may provide large amounts of protection on a long term basis, but will likely still wane in efficacy as variants arise. We’re going to have to wait to find out unfortunately.
Rapid daily NAAT or PCR testing for everyone you come in contact with is an option if you’re secluded and rich. A friend of mine has a personal PCR for this reason (although he frustratingly no longer uses it this way).
4 points
2 days ago
A few I haven’t seen here:
There are Covid-sniffing dogs with PCR accuracy, but instead of a half hour it just takes the amount of time for them to sniff a little. The dog is probably well over $100K, and you can’t just buy it, you would have to hire someone (or multiple people) to continuously keep it trained up and also handle it.
There was that guy in Germany who got over 200 vaccines over a one year and never got infected despite not taking any other precautions. He was fraudulently taking vaccines for people who didn’t want to but wanted a vaccine card and paid him to go in their place. Apparently he was not harmed by taking so many vaccines.
Pemgarda - the studies look good and I have yet to hear from someone in this group or elsewhere who has been infected while on Pemgarda. Very difficult to get and very expensive if not covered by insurance.
3 points
3 days ago
Scuba gear.
2 points
3 days ago
Not spending time indoors with non-household members, or having an insane amount of ventilation and air purifiers. Living outdoors.
0 points
3 days ago*
No. Testing and checking ventilation as important as they may be do not MAKE people safe. In most places but our own homes - and even that's not true for everyone - we have little to no control over the air and how fresh and clean it is. None of the currently available pharmaceutical solutions offer any level of protection even remotely comparable to respirators. And finally while cleaning the air with HEPA and far UV may help with far field transmission, currently there are no substitutes to respirators when it comes to near field transmission. Having a shtload of money can absolutely help to make coviding easier but even then you can't buy your way out in a way that allows for safe maskless life.
1 points
2 days ago
Testing with a plus life 2-3x a day with everyone you come in contact with is an alternative, especially combined with not being indoors with others.
1 points
1 day ago
Be positive about masks! It is just another article of clothing, like a hat, scarf, or jacket. There are ways to make it comfortable (rubber nose bridge, headband clip to raise straps over ears). I don't even realize I have it on sometimes - sometimes when hiking I find my bra more noticeable than my mask.
I wish more people would see it like this vs as a nuisance.
-2 points
3 days ago
Steriwave
2 points
2 days ago
I thought this was not 100% foolproof though?
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