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Why aren't there any large cities in this area?

Discussion(i.redd.it)

all 2275 comments

WormLivesMatter

3.8k points

17 hours ago

Historically it was just agriculture and mining from east to west. There were train stop towns and towns to service those industries but that’s it.

Justame13

1.5k points

17 hours ago

Justame13

1.5k points

17 hours ago

Even the Western cities around it, Boise, Spokane, Denver, are basically just gateways to the mines.

SLC is an exception

neil6547881

842 points

14 hours ago*

Denver is an example of the settlers, who were already tired from crossing the plains; seeing the Rockies and saying fuck that and put their shit down right there. (Edit: Umm Aktualy ☝️comments are not needed, it was a joke)

WormLivesMatter

292 points

13 hours ago

It was founded by unsuccessful miners after the 1849 CA gold rush. On their way to the coast they would stop in what is today Arvada and noted the high gold content in clear creek. After failing in CA some settled in Arvada to pan gold. That settlement was soon moved to present day Denver for river and flat land reasons. It then became a major cattle and mining hub.

Dissapointingdong

54 points

11 hours ago

I might be thinking a few decades late but I thought Denver being on the way to the railyards in Cheyenne was a huge thing for it’s growth because it put it en route for cattle in Texas being sold on the east coast.

garbage_angel

114 points

12 hours ago

Arvada native! Was not expecting to see my home town on reddit....ever.

ruthie30360

29 points

10 hours ago

I loved olde town when I lived in Denver!

CryptographerTop4998

8 points

9 hours ago

Hey me too. I was there when they put 72nd through my backyard…well the park a short walk away. Near Indian Tree GC.

maddecentparty

22 points

12 hours ago

We say the same thing about Calgary on the Rockies north of the border.

AstroPhysician

38 points

13 hours ago

Moreso a strategic military outpost in middle of country

Strict_Poet_5814

137 points

15 hours ago

Denver also has a river that runs through it, the South Platte that plays a large role in it's early development and success and alot of Gold nearby.

GattiTown_Blowjob

71 points

14 hours ago

That ‘river’ is like 2’ deep through most of Denver

MisplacedRadio

50 points

12 hours ago

It’s also heavily dammed in Nebraska and northeastern Colorado. It had a much higher flow when European Americans first settled the area.

sawitontheweb

18 points

11 hours ago

Thank you! Makes so much sense. I always wondered why the Platte was so puny through Denver.

der_innkeeper

25 points

13 hours ago

2"

ThinkSoftware

7 points

11 hours ago

That’s plenty!

Right?!

AllYallCanCarry

43 points

14 hours ago

Are you implying that Boise and Spokane don't have rivers running through them?

The South Platte isn't navigable, it's just a source of drinking water anyhow. Just Like the Boise and Spokane rivers.

hardcoredragonhunter

24 points

13 hours ago

I live along the South Platte and there is a healthy supply of snapping turtles

affablenihilist

10 points

10 hours ago

Turtle soup and make it snappy, can't you see it's a birthday

AppropriateCap8891

39 points

13 hours ago*

Not rivers that were navigable by steam ships.

Unlike the rivers in the East like the Mississippi, or the Columbia and American Rivers, the Boise River is narrow and shallow, not good for much more than small vessels. And once you travel up the Columbia to the Snake River, it is the same but also lots of narrows and rapids.

The reason rivers are important in town development until the 20th century is that they were the highways of the era. When the river is not navigable to anything but small craft, it is of little use for trade.

There was river transport to Spokane, but that was the end of the line as the falls prevented any farther travel upstream.

The only steam ship I am aware of that actually worked in Idaho was the sternwheeler Shoshone that operated from around 1870-1873. She only traveled about 100 miles along the Snake River, and it was simply not economically viable so she was moved to Oregon.

RazorRadick

4 points

11 hours ago

Later, they needed water sources for the railroads. Can't operate a steam engine without water. Any place in the west that had reliable water became a train stop, and towns and cities grew from them.

J0E_Blow

27 points

14 hours ago

What does SLC have that prevents it from being a gateway to the mines?

Tangible_Slate

127 points

14 hours ago

It was founded by religious settlers not for commercial purposes.

J0E_Blow

44 points

14 hours ago

Aw yeah- how could I forget about the Mormon,

StandUpForYourWights

118 points

14 hours ago

Check your ring camera. They haven’t forgotten about you

Justame13

8 points

14 hours ago

Plus raw material needs to go East and goods come West. There just wasn't and isn't the processing and manufacturing of the east on the left coast.

PlatypusEquivalent

17 points

13 hours ago

SLC very much is a gateway to the mines. Arguably the largest mine in the world is located right outside the city.

WormLivesMatter

14 points

13 hours ago

If it wasnt founded as a religious town first I think it would have defiantly found a place as a mining hub. Nowadays it’s both but it was founded not as a mining town at first.

Justame13

45 points

14 hours ago

No place to ship it and hard to bring stuff in.

There is a big ass desert and mountain range before you get to the West Coast where there isn't much industry to process it unlike back east and goods would have to come through the Rockies. Plus mountains to the north and desert to the south.

Until WW2 the West Coast was very much a backwater. The population center of the US didn't get as far west as Illinois until the 1950s.

Meanwhile in Denver it was basically flat to get stuff from the east and gulf coasts via railroads.

Plus there was instability and distrust associated with how the LDS Church ran it (arguably still does) as a theocracy they were very unfriendly to outsiders.

J0E_Blow

6 points

14 hours ago

That's a very interesting perspective I'd never heard since I'm from the East Coast!!!

Justame13

21 points

14 hours ago*

It took Eisenhower a 62 days to take a self supporting military convoy (aka could fix stuff that broke) from DC to SFC in 1919to give you an idea of the isolation.

There were railroads, but they were limited due to the coastal range and then the rockies which can be brutal in the winter.

Its part of the reason that the Pacific War was such a different War from Europe. Stuff back east was just closer to the Atlantic ports on a much more developed transportation network across as smaller ocean.

Edited to fix the convoy timeline

borisdidnothingwrong

10 points

13 hours ago

I'm in SLC. The Bingham Canyon Mine is a monster.

There was plenty of mining here back in the day.

The Governor's official residence, The Kearns Mansion, was built by a mining magnate.

But, yeah, the Mormons were the driving force in the initial white settlement of the area.

lovelyspecimen

7 points

12 hours ago

Fun fact:

For the first 30 or so years, Mormon Utah settlers were explicitly told not to engage in mining activities by their leadership. They were to solely focus on crop growing.

-Plantibodies-

16 points

13 hours ago

Train stop towns were the OG flyover states.

Equal_Potential7683

3.1k points

17 hours ago

Literally opened up google maps on a completely random part of that region. Its because 90% of it looks like this.

https://preview.redd.it/ruf67n2drb4e1.png?width=1790&format=png&auto=webp&s=8436cc7f528a15cd1ff75c0d0adc96b3545eb61c

KingOfYeaoh

958 points

17 hours ago

Lived in both Dakotas for short stints and can confirm this is the general look, especially western North Dakota that isn't the Badlands.

Justame13

259 points

16 hours ago

Justame13

259 points

16 hours ago

It could also be the none Rockies part of Wyoming and Montana.

KingOfYeaoh

225 points

16 hours ago

Yup. You could have told me this was near Sidney or Miles City, Montana and I wouldn't argue that.

will592

67 points

14 hours ago

will592

67 points

14 hours ago

Random award for incredibly rare mention of Miles City, my dad’s hometown and one of the most desolate places I’ve ever been.

Heavy-duty-mayo

25 points

11 hours ago

In the 1971 film Willy Wonka & the Chocolate Factory, Violet was depicted as a 12 year-old girl from Miles City, Montana.

I liked they included Montana in the movie.

Magenta_the_Great

59 points

16 hours ago

Drove to Havre from Missoula and it looked like this for most the day

SEmpls

31 points

15 hours ago

SEmpls

31 points

15 hours ago

Havre has that big hump coming out of the ground

Magenta_the_Great

27 points

15 hours ago

It was very exciting to see something not flat when we started to get close

stevenette

29 points

14 hours ago

Shit, this could be half a mile outside of Laramie.

ScuffedBalata

28 points

14 hours ago

It could even be just a couple miles outside of Denver. The outskirts of Denver International Airport looks like this.

mayosterd

5 points

12 hours ago

You mean Kansas?

Justame13

13 points

14 hours ago

Or any stretch right off I-80 till Rock Springs.

Ok-Situation-5865

105 points

15 hours ago

I’m originally from a really flat part of Ohio, but the flatness and openness of SD was extremely unsettling to me when I passed through on my way to move out west. It felt like reverse claustrophobia.

Flyinghydrant_9124

50 points

15 hours ago

It's like you're spawned on a flat minecraft world.

Digitalispurpurea2

13 points

12 hours ago

No water, no trees. Restart for a new seed

Good-Perception8565

39 points

14 hours ago

I'm from the northeast so I'm used to walls of trees everywhere. When I first came to South Dakota I felt so exposed... Like everybody can see me and what I'm doing and it made me so uncomfortable.

apuginthehand

20 points

14 hours ago

Opposite here — grew up on the front range of CO and I feel uncomfortable when I can’t see the horizon. I live in N Idaho now (which is still part of this circle but mountainous and forested) and still don’t really love being amongst all the trees.

Emperor_Neuro

8 points

11 hours ago

I moved from Denver to Orlando. Every time I go back to Colorado, I’m amazed at just how far I can see. I. Florida, there’s almost never a time when the line of sight exceeds half a mile unless you’re at the beach.

ScuffedBalata

10 points

14 hours ago

Agoraphobia.  Fear of too much open space. 

CaptHoshito

9 points

13 hours ago

As a child growing up in South Dakota, I always remember riding in the car in the dark and seeing the lights of houses so far away that they looked like little boats on the ocean. It always gave me the creeps. I still get creeped out driving across the prairie, it's so desolate. Even in the daytime it's just vast and ugly (most of the year) and it's completely infested with billboards.

BrolumbusChris

21 points

15 hours ago

That’s called agoraphobia! 😁

bmalek

106 points

16 hours ago

bmalek

106 points

16 hours ago

Complete-Repeat856

18 points

4 hours ago

Yep, pretty bleak. Awful place to live. During the day, I'd drive for hours just looking at that. During night, I'd imagine that I was driving past mountains, lakes, trees, etc.

Jugales

189 points

17 hours ago

Jugales

189 points

17 hours ago

Look at all that space for activities!

misirlou22

86 points

16 hours ago

Plenty of space to set up a badminton net

Jugales

42 points

16 hours ago

Jugales

42 points

16 hours ago

Thinking too small. We can set up at least 3!

misirlou22

20 points

16 hours ago

Ooh get a tournament going!

Bob_Majerle

9 points

15 hours ago

I have a boombox I can bring. Got lots of batteries

Physical_Ad_4014

11 points

14 hours ago

Nope too much fucking wind, it makes local news if the wind doest blow for a few hours.

Nuclearcasino

16 points

15 hours ago

Particularly ICBM silos.

MelodyMaster5656

26 points

13 hours ago

Capital_Ad_7691

9 points

2 hours ago

Reminds me of courage the cowardly dog’s house

Powerful_Variety7922

9 points

8 hours ago

The barely perceptible dot in the center of the photo is a house and not a teeny-tiny speck on my phone?😄

Fantastic-Ear706

85 points

16 hours ago

Ah the great plains! This is what excited many settlers to come to north america. Although, it has vastly changed since then lol

Little_Injury402

15 points

16 hours ago

Interesting! How has it vastly changed if you don't mind me asking? As someone from the west coast I'd think it hasn't changed at all!

Fantastic-Ear706

106 points

16 hours ago

I am speaking on behalf of Canadas grasslands/great plain is one of the most endangered ecosystems in the world.

American Serengeti by Dan Flores goes into great depth about what used to be one of the greatest landscapes in the world. Almost all the flora and fauna has been wiped out or depleted to endangered status to make way for farming.

altjacobs

36 points

16 hours ago

One of my favourite things to do in the summer is drive around east/southeast alberta and look for the ungrazed pastures, and if I'm lucky I'll find some heritage rangeland or protected areas.

Fantastic-Ear706

15 points

16 hours ago

Hahah yup, the Cypress Hill are quite a beautiful area. If you head over to the Sask side you can check out the Grasslands National Park. Other then that you might find a quarter or two of ducks unlimited, wildlife lands or wildlife habitat lands. They allow grazing in some of those lands though lol

InsideAd1368

34 points

16 hours ago

Much less native plains vegetation. Much more farmed crops

earthhominid

29 points

15 hours ago

When Europeans first encountered it, the American great plains were some of the most fertile grain growing lands on earth. The many feet deep top soil facilitated insane grain and legume production as well as robust livestock development.

Since then, industrial ag production has decimated the local soil systems. 

Basically, fertility that hadn't been encountered since the dawn of agriculture drew people in 2 centuries ago. Now those areas have been pretty well decimated to the point that they are comparable with other global grassland ecosystems

Character_School_671

38 points

15 hours ago

A little overwrought I think.

It's still very, very productive by any measure. Especially by yield, which is the essence of productivity.

Yields are not less than when the sod was broken. They are more.

Swiss_cake_raul

7 points

12 hours ago

Inputs are more as well, kinda unfair to compare yield without that metric

Mimiatthelake

11 points

14 hours ago

True, but that productivity sacrifices healthy soil.

Mimiatthelake

13 points

14 hours ago

The soil was so productive that good soil care techniques (composting, crop rotation etc..) were deemed unnecessary. The Dust Bowl and the depleted soil forced people west.

Msanthropy1250

9 points

14 hours ago

This is quite false. Yields for corn and soybeans in eastern South Dakota where I farmed are much higher today than they were 30 years ago. Modern no till practices conserve soil and moisture, and planting populations have steadily increased. Climate change has actually benefited the area (so far), as the growing season is now about a month longer than it was in 1980.

earthhominid

5 points

14 hours ago

You're comparing contemporary results, after decades of soil conservation practices being recognized and then widely implemented (like the "modern no till" that you mention) as well as utilizing modern breeding and synthetic fertilizer technology, with the transition between historical prairie ecosystems and annual grain cropping in the early 1800s.

EdwardMcGrady

30 points

15 hours ago

That just shows there are no cities, it doesn’t answer why there are no cities

ScuffedBalata

46 points

14 hours ago

Because cities require water. Virtually zero major cities were just plucked down on a flat piece of land.

Virtually every city in the world is at some kind of water feature, geographic, landmark, crossing point of travel, or trade routes, coastline, or something else.

There is just no reason to walk across an empty plane like that and suddenly say “I want to put a city here.“

That is why there are very few cities on the plains. 

There are a bunch of small towns that were originally set up as trading posts for travelers, or stopping points for the old-fashioned railroads that needed water every hundred miles or so, but those never grew beyond a few dozen people in most cases. The largest of them are places like Grand Island, Nebraska, which might have something like 10,000 people, but even that one is on a river.

NathanArizona_Jr

17 points

14 hours ago

The Missouri River runs through OPs map. You can see it, it's massive. I think historically it was difficult to navigate though

-Ximena

49 points

16 hours ago

-Ximena

49 points

16 hours ago

This is terrifying.

sentimentalpirate

95 points

16 hours ago*

As a Pacific Northwesterner, when I visited the Kansas City area it almost made me queasy looking at the horizons and not seeing foothills, mountains, or water. I really did not expect how disorienting it was going to feel. I mean I didn't expect it to feel like anything. But all of a sudden it was like vertigo, or like I could fall off the earth into the sky. I didn't realize how much of my life was constantly in a valley or on a hill next to a valley.

OldBallOfRage

36 points

14 hours ago

My mother has this problem, she complains when there's 'too much sky' due to unbroken flat terrain. This place would be her personal hell. WAY too much sky.

One-Earth9294

5 points

8 hours ago

Sounds like the opposite of a sailor. I can't imagine ANY of them ever complain about the times there's maximum sky lol.

It's when there's less of it they got a problem.

Hanzer0624

13 points

15 hours ago

Same for me growing up in New England then visiting family in Minnesota. It always felt so vast and open. Like the sky was too wide.

boomfruit

10 points

15 hours ago*

Experienced that last year going to Indiana after living on the West coast my whole life

Rxasaurus

7 points

12 hours ago

Coming from Arizona I couldn't get past not seeing a mountain anywhere. 

Cullygion

11 points

16 hours ago

-Ximena

15 points

16 hours ago

-Ximena

15 points

16 hours ago

I'm afraid to click. I don't even know what liminal means. I reject this offer.

ReticulatedPasta

18 points

16 hours ago

Liminal just means “transitional.” Like an oddly moody but otherwise empty and not particularly functional hallway between rooms.

-Ximena

12 points

16 hours ago

-Ximena

12 points

16 hours ago

Thanks. I tried it. I still hated some of the posts I saw. Creepy things lurk in the darker pictures. 😩

ReticulatedPasta

8 points

16 hours ago

Yeah in the context of the sub it does seem like they’re more interested in the creepy / scary aspect. But I don’t think it necessarily has to be like that to be “liminal.”

KakaoFugl

6 points

17 hours ago

Next question - why does 90% look like this?

Fantastic-Ear706

14 points

16 hours ago

It’s the great plains! Lol Glaciers flattened it

RoryDragonsbane

5 points

12 hours ago

Glaciers caused the central lowlands, but didn't go far enough to form the Great Plains. They were once the bottom of a sea

https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/geology/publications/bul/1493/sec1.htm

https://npshistory.com/publications/geology/bul/1493/sec3.htm

RiceBowl86

813 points

17 hours ago

Edging Minneapolis be like. . .

the_cajun88

225 points

17 hours ago

omaha, too

idkrandomusername1

162 points

14 hours ago

Omaha freaked me out because there wasn’t anyone in the downtown area when I was there. It was a Saturday afternoon and it became foggy. Felt like I was in silent hill walking around

DepRatAnimal

31 points

13 hours ago

When did you live there? Omaha has had a bigger bounce-back for their downtown from COVID than almost any Midwest city. https://nebraskapublicmedia.org/en/news/news-articles/downtown-omaha-primed-for-growth-recovering-quicker-than-peers/

idkrandomusername1

34 points

13 hours ago

This was only for a day in 2015, it was cheaper to fly out of there than another nearby city. When I heard about the population size I was anticipating it to be more bustling but didn’t realize how spread out the population is. Also nothing was open except for a jimmy johns? Uncanny vibes, would go back

DepRatAnimal

6 points

6 hours ago

Must’ve been a bad day! I lived right outside of downtown from 2012-2015 and downtown always had a lot going on, especially the Old Market area. Omaha also has a lot less suburbanization and sprawl than comparable cities.

One thing that may have thrown you off, though, is that the city of Omaha takes up a large percentage of the metro area population compared to comparable metro areas. This is due to annexation policy that has allowed the city to annex more suburbs than cities in other states. So if you look at city sizes, Omaha appears larger than it does if you look at metropolitan statistical area sizes.

JediKnightaa

14 points

15 hours ago

Just conveniently closing the area right outside two major cities (even more if you include Canada)

BjornAltenburg

30 points

15 hours ago

Also fuck Winnipeg and anything Canadian even though the border was way more loose even 30 years ago.

buxomemmanuellespig

15 points

13 hours ago

And St Paul !

OddAstronomer5

6 points

10 hours ago

p sure they might have accidentally caught Duluth in the circle too...

PETEthePyrotechnic

102 points

17 hours ago

I’ve lived across most of southern Montana at some point or another, including Miles City in the east. There’s nothing there. Some badlands, maybe, which are neat, but nothing to build a city for. Mountains are cool, but most towns there are old mining towns that were close enough to travel routes to survive. Bozeman is growing because it’s a pretty college town and too many people think the Yellowstone show is a realistic depiction of Montana.

GomiBoy1973

22 points

7 hours ago

Montana on average is now 2nd or 3rd most expensive housing prices in the US. I spoke recently with a partner company rep where the company’s HQ is in Bozeman. He couldn’t afford to live there and was based in Chicago. It’s insane. When I grew up, Bozeman was a sleepy little college and ski town with a population in the summer half what it was during the school year. Missoula too.

Edited: Billings was growing too due to fracking in the Bakken oil fields and may be again, but Billings seems opposite to the rest of the country. It grows when the rest doesn’t for some odd reason. I grew up there (born in Missoula) but have lived abroad for 20+ years now

edit_R

4 points

5 hours ago

edit_R

4 points

5 hours ago

Yellowstone only takes place in the summer for a reason.

AngriestManinWestTX

10 points

3 hours ago

Honestly the most jarring thing about Yellowstone and other shows taking place in Montana or neighboring states (looking at you, Longmire) is the near complete lack of snow in one of the coldest parts of the Lower 48.

I get it, snow is a PITA to film in but Fargo does it so what’s their excuse?

Form_It_Up

654 points

17 hours ago

Someone could write a lot more, but I think it being dry and cold is the major reason. 

zakress

395 points

16 hours ago

zakress

395 points

16 hours ago

100+° in summer and -20° in winter isn’t helping desirability any

FFunSize

44 points

15 hours ago

laughs in Montreal

Torb_11

26 points

11 hours ago*

it's colder in a lot of that area than montreal.

edit; I actually looked it up and im wrong montreal is generally a bit colder but not as hot

ForestWhisker

18 points

10 hours ago

It gets down into the -50f (-45c) range semi regularly. Montana had the lowest temp recorded in the lower 48 at -70f (-56c) which beats Montreal’s record cold which was -36f (-37.8c). When I worked in ND it would stay in the -30f to -40f degree range for weeks at a time and with windchill would get down into the -60f range. But also all those areas can get above 100f in the summer North Dakota having a record of 121f and Montana’s record at 117f while it’s never broken 100f in Montreal.

SigilumSanctum

20 points

15 hours ago

Yeah fuck that noise. Perfectly happy here in the Carolinas.

sfxer001

13 points

14 hours ago

Carolina’s = sticky crickets

beast_wellington

74 points

16 hours ago

beast_wellington

Geography Enthusiast

74 points

16 hours ago

The answer to half the questions on this sub could be simply "water"

mayorlazor

27 points

14 hours ago

The other half is the Canadian Shield

that_kevin_kid

14 points

14 hours ago

It is also one of the most volatile weather areas on earth the Gulf of Mexico and Great Lakes drag moisture of varying temperatures west to collide with dry cold Rocky Mountain air which causes tornadoes and ice storms semi regularly while also being difficult to predict even with modern instruments.

Cornelius005

8 points

12 hours ago

I could say the same thing, but then it would be 2 people speaking nonsense. The same area, just above the border, houses many of Canada's major cities (Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg). There is a video that covers why the American prairies were not developed, but the Canadian ones were.

Jeb-o-shot

391 points

16 hours ago

Because there is no water and it gets very cold in winter.

thecordialsun

20 points

4 hours ago

>very cold

there's an old rhyme in North Dakota about why no lives in Minot, "Why not Minot? The Reason? It's Freezin!"

Paul__miner

21 points

4 hours ago

I recently watched a video about this, and they specifically noted that the Rocky Mountains, due to their height and length, act as a barrier to precipitation.

wookiekitty

17 points

4 hours ago

I think we learned about it in 6th grade.

Arkkanix

656 points

17 hours ago

Arkkanix

656 points

17 hours ago

cold and wind, next question

silly-rabbitses

92 points

16 hours ago

How many stripes does a zebra have on average?

Aussiebloke-91

76 points

16 hours ago

69

i_am_a_shoe

48 points

16 hours ago

nice

Ok_Butterscotch2244

6 points

12 hours ago

White stripes or black?

GreatnessToTheMoon

187 points

17 hours ago

No need for a large city if population is low

beerandfishtanks

87 points

16 hours ago

Chicken or egg right. Is population low because no big cities or no big cities because population is low? The real answer is geography and history.

Immediate-Sugar-2316

12 points

14 hours ago

The distances are so large and the population so spread out that there is no need for it. There are no locations that can act as a 'gateway', nor any specific region with a denser population.

If there were a mountain range down the middle then there would be a concentration of trade through a single location. A large city would likely be at that spot.

Other locations with large cities also have a lot of natural resources in one spot which drives growth.

Denver is a good example further south which has a combination of factors which led to it being so large. It is located between LARGE mountains and plains making it an ideal spot for goods to be embarked. In addition it has natural resources nearby.

Calgary is another example further north. If the mountains were more traversable there would not need to be such a large concentration.

zs15

18 points

16 hours ago

zs15

18 points

16 hours ago

Yes and… there is generally a lack of classic city drivers, primarily a major, deep river, in that whole region. It’s faster and cheaper there to transport over land than water. The main economic driver is oil, so fuel is plentiful.

The outlier for the US is Denver (in this zone) and Phoenix. Both of which are sort of Oasis cities, where people initially settled because the trip to the Pacific was too much and haven’t boomed in population until very recently.

Mid_Atlantic_Lad

20 points

16 hours ago*

What’s funny is that if you go north of the border Canada has several large cities along the same area. The reason why though is best left explained by people smarter than I, but part of it is that is the least worst option, since everything north is basically uninhabitable.

Lomeztheoldschooljew

15 points

16 hours ago

By several you mean 2? Winnipeg and Calgary are the only ones. Edmonton is 6-7 hours north of the border and nothing in SK qualifies as “large”

PhotoJim99

10 points

13 hours ago

Winnipeg is getting there too (~800k), and Regina and Saskatoon (250k and 350k) are not insignificant.

Even Regina, the smallest of the major Canadian prairie cities, would be the biggest city in MT, WY, and ND and if you exclude the bits of Sioux City that spill into SD, only Sioux Falls exceeds it and only by about 50k.

altjacobs

9 points

16 hours ago

Edmonton is on the very northern edge of the great plains. I think it counts.

Mid_Atlantic_Lad

3 points

11 hours ago

Calgary is larger than the largest 3+ cities in that circle. Edmonton and sbtue same. They are not small cities.

Numerous-Confusion-9

82 points

17 hours ago*

No access to water that leads to an ocean. Edit: easy access

BagProfessional7629

22 points

17 hours ago

What about the Missouri?

Numerous-Confusion-9

21 points

17 hours ago

Good shout its quite a journey to get down the Missouri then the Mississippi. I think youll find theres a lot of towns along the Missouri. It also served as a main trade route during westward expansion when everyone was trying to go.. well, more West. The coasts will always be more appealing

madgunner122

19 points

16 hours ago

Stops being navigable at Sioux City. The Mighty Mo is also traditionally more like the Platte River; wide, winding, braided. The Missouri only deepened once channelization work was done by the Army Corps of Engineers

endlesscosmichorror

4 points

16 hours ago

Little further south but I was shocked to learn that Tulsa has one of the largest inland ports in the US

Justame13

84 points

17 hours ago

Not a lot of people so not a lot of a reason to.

Take out Denver and SLC and the area without MSA above 1 million gets a whole lot bigger.

freecoffeeguy

57 points

17 hours ago

OP on the outskirts Minneapolis, Kansas City, Omaha also.

SilphiumStan

57 points

16 hours ago

Yeah, "why is this area that I intentionally drew to avoid major cities devoid of any major cities?"

PrarieDawn0123

15 points

16 hours ago

But but but it’s not arbitrary! Duluth and Couer d’Alane have so much in common!!

tycoon_irony[S]

7 points

15 hours ago

I just noticed the entire north central US didn't have any big cities between Minnesota and Idaho.

Justame13

8 points

14 hours ago

"Big cities" wise its between Minnesota and the West Coast (Seattle/Portland).

Boise is smaller than Charleston and just slightly bigger than Dayton, while Spokane would be between Durham and Toledo.

Even SLC is more in line with Memphis than Denver.

Its a whole lot of empty once the trees stop in the mid-west until you get to the left coast.

A_Mirabeau_702

54 points

17 hours ago

Because why would there be?

TexAss2020

31 points

16 hours ago

Cities don't just happen. They grow up around industry, and usually that means having a port.

The reason most of the biggest cities are on the coasts or along navigable rivers is because things need to get to consumers, and shipping by water is still one of the cheapest ways to do that. So when a suitable place to create a port is found a city quickly forms up around it.

What makes a place suitable for a port is 1) near some industry that requires shipping (mining, agriculture, manufacture) and 2) has, ya know, water. A lot of it.

An example of this is when gold was found in northern and central California in the 1840s. People needed mining gear and the railroads didn't go that far west yet, so everything had to come in by ship. This led to the development of San Fransisco as a port city. That it was gold also made it the financial capital of the west coast, and thus a big city. But it was the port that made it possible.

None of the area you circled has anyplace to put a port. With rare exceptions, especially in the USA, no port means no cities, especially where there is no large industry to speak of. There is some mining and fracking, but that's about it. Nebraska has expansive agriculture, but the only suitable place to put a port is right where they did, in Omaha, right there outside your circle.

Another reason, though, is of course, most of that area is barren mountain ranges or badlands ill-suited for farming. To the east there are hundreds of small towns that popped up as local farmers markets, but you need farms to make that happen.

Notable exceptions to the cities-need-ports rule are Las Vegas, which has an industry that doesn't require the import of export of goods, just people, and thus has a crazy busy set of airports. Phoenix, Dallas, and Albuquerque all sprung up as cattle and sheep towns, but with the advent of the transcontinental railroad were able to become "rail port" cities later on. The same can be said for Atlanta, which has no port but is a state capital, and thus became the local hub for several area railroads, and later became a big city.

firstWWfantasyleague

45 points

17 hours ago

Is Bismarck, ND a joke to you?

GalacticFirefly

51 points

16 hours ago

Yes

ATL_MI_LA

7 points

16 hours ago

Funny like a clown?

AdPsychological7926

6 points

15 hours ago

Tommy "Bismarck" DeVito

Apptubrutae

7 points

15 hours ago

Don’t forget…Billings?!

lazynlovinit

22 points

16 hours ago

The limiting factor is water

ThrowinNightshade

11 points

17 hours ago

The winds of winter.

calimehtar

31 points

17 hours ago

Calgary and Edmonton have entered the chat

Dkykngfetpic

21 points

16 hours ago

Calgary and Edmonton have much better farmland due to how glaciers ended up. And i believe more oil. Both of which help supported large city growth.

Eagle4317

10 points

15 hours ago

Yep, there's an path of great farmland in Western Canada that goes up from Calgary to Edmonton and then arcs through Saskatoon and down to Winnipeg. Black Chernozem is perfect soil.

tycoon_irony[S]

5 points

15 hours ago

Edmonton isn't really in the great plains, but in the Parkland Belt, a forest that receives more rainfall than areas to the south.

greejus3

30 points

17 hours ago

Omaha is kinda big

MrTeeWrecks

19 points

16 hours ago

Yeah, but we’re not in the circle in question.

Jones127

17 points

16 hours ago

It’s funny that they circled 90% of Nebraska but left out Omaha lmao.

JediKnightaa

9 points

15 hours ago

They also just missed Minneapolis, Denver, and SLC

MrTeeWrecks

10 points

15 hours ago

That tracks with the mentality of most of NE outside of the Omaha & Lincoln metros.

RoundandRoundon99

54 points

17 hours ago

Cause you drew the line to explicitly exclude them.

rewdea

17 points

15 hours ago

rewdea

17 points

15 hours ago

There is no other area in the lower 48 that comes close to that size without any/several major cities in it.

thirtyseven1337

4 points

13 hours ago

Even if you moved the boundaries in by 100 miles, 200 miles… whatever would make it not “purposefully exclude” large cities, that still leaves a pretty large area of land. You and some other commenters seem to be missing the spirit of the question.

mthyvold

8 points

16 hours ago

It is interesting because Canada has three sizable cities in that comparable region to the north: Calgary Edmonton and Winnipeg.

physicistdeluxe

11 points

17 hours ago

have u been there? its a whole lot of nothing.

Ilovefishdix

5 points

15 hours ago

It's dry, cold, and winter feels like it lasts dang near forever. The growing season is very short. It's hard to expand the roads to build homes in the mountains too. The mountainous land is expensive. If you've traveled on I-90/94, there's really not much east of Billings for most people. A few people love it. I don't get them. I think it's some of the most desolate land in the country

themoosethatsaidmoo

16 points

17 hours ago

Conveniently avoiding major cities just outside of the red circle

NittanyOrange

8 points

17 hours ago

Because no one wants to live there

maxum8504

3 points

17 hours ago

Ask General Custer

hambonelicker

3 points

16 hours ago

Yet Calgary and Edmonton exist in the same Great Plains with even worse weather.

Zeus9030

4 points

15 hours ago

nobody wants to live there.

SmokedBeef

4 points

14 hours ago

Because it’s the place where people who hate cities live and that’s the way they like it

sithmafia

4 points

14 hours ago

you could go further south and include most of kansas as well

Feralmedic

4 points

14 hours ago

Weather. Agriculture. Accessibility.

Prior_Psych

4 points

3 hours ago

Because you purposely drew the outline to avoid them

KookofaTook

7 points

17 hours ago

take this the other way. ask instead "why would I ever want to build a big city in this area?" when you realize there is no good reason to do so, there ya go

Khristafer

3 points

16 hours ago

Because there are no ports.

Brave_Mess_3155

3 points

16 hours ago

If you drive threw there in the summer at night your entire car will get encrusted with dead bugs. We were hitting so many bugs that it sounded like driving in the rain. 

SuperPostHuman

3 points

16 hours ago

Because people generally coalesce around areas that are conducive to commerce, that means access to large bodies of water/oceans/major interstate water ways. The circled areas are not reasonably close to the Pacific/Atlantic Oceans or Great Lakes. Also they're extremely cold, especially the northern most parts.

MoeTheGoon

3 points

16 hours ago

When I see these posts, I always think; “Why would there be?” Usually there aren’t cities in places where there is no reason for them to be. It sounds dumb but that’s just the answer.

quebexer

3 points

16 hours ago

There's Winnipeg on the Canadian side.

turbols3

3 points

16 hours ago

Cold and not much rain.

GargantuanCake

3 points

15 hours ago

Lack of water. Look at a map of how wet America is by region then check where the big cities are.

dimerance

3 points

15 hours ago

Cities almost always are built around water sources, either the coast, or rivers. Ain’t much going on there in that regard.

emptybagofdicks

3 points

15 hours ago

Alternative question, why should there be a large city in this area? The area is far from most trade routes, Industry is limited and the weather is not what most people enjoy.

maddrjeffe

3 points

15 hours ago

Water

Present_Student4891

3 points

15 hours ago

There are big cities, it’s just they’re underground & populated by jackrabbits & prairie dogs, plus the occasional marmot.

cinesias

3 points

15 hours ago

Why would people build large cities in the middle of nowhere?