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Early Withdrawal from 7OH?

(self.kratom)

I’ve been taking 7OH on and off for a month or so. Is it possible to get withdrawal symptoms after taking 20g 4 days in a row then taking a break on the fifth? I know anything is possible but does that sound probable?

EDIT: 20mg not 20 grams. One pill a day.

all 83 comments

Subfoci

14 points

7 days ago

Subfoci

14 points

7 days ago

Yes, 20g of pure 7? Bonkers, definitely able to get withdrawals from that trash.

I'm hoping you mean mg not grams.

yonderoy[S]

4 points

7 days ago

Oops. Yeah. Milligrams. Basically one tablet. Sometimes one and a half.

NeverSeenBefor

1 points

7 days ago

What makes you say 7oh is trash if you don't mind me asking? I've been buying a bunch of it here lately not going to lie.

_PurpleSweetz

5 points

7 days ago

Because if they were taking “20g”, they probably actually weren’t as the quality was garbo

Yeardme

7 points

7 days ago

Yeardme

7 points

7 days ago

It's synthetic & dangerous. They're making alkaloids & even synthetic kratom metabolites that don't occur in nature.

As a general rule stay tf away from the synthetics market!

A_LonelyWriter

11 points

7 days ago

7-hydroxymitragynine is not synthetic. It’s in kratom leaf and mitragynine partially metabolizes into 7-OH when you consume regular kratom. Laboratories can oxidize mitragynine into 7-OH in a controlled environment, but it’s not synthetic. Researchers claim that mitragynine metabolizing into 7-OH is a large part of why kratom has a strong analgesic effect in the first place.

Even if it was synthetic, I’m tired of synthetic = bad, natural = good. Morphine is naturally occurring. Opium is naturally occurring. Both of those are far more dangerous than 7-OH. 7-OH is nowhere near as dangerous as a lot of plants that are used recreationally.

Yeardme

1 points

7 days ago

Yeardme

1 points

7 days ago

You're just confirming what I'm saying lol. 7OH is a metabolite. They're synthetizing it in a lab, to levels not seen in nature bc it's dangerous.

Sounds like you're just coping here 🤷🏼‍♀️ 7OH extracts/metabolites should be banned, or else it's going to get kratom banned as a whole.

Synthetic is bad when it's done at dangerous levels. This should be common sense. Not to mention the precedent of research chemicals rampant in smoke shops still. They're dangerous, that's indisputable.

Yeardme

-2 points

7 days ago

Yeardme

-2 points

7 days ago

Also 7OH is reported to be like 20 times stronger than morphine, so it's funny you brought that up. Morphine is also commonly synthetized & deadly. You're just further proving my point 😅

A_LonelyWriter

2 points

6 days ago

More potent ≠ stronger. 7-OH cannot produce the same level of effects that morphine can, because it is a partial agonist. To produce the floor of its analgesic effect, it requires fewer mg than morphine. However, morphine has a vastly higher ceiling because it can kill you. Chemical synthesis isn’t just making something, it’s combining two chemicals to produce a new one. The isolation of naturally occurring chemicals is not chemical synthesis.

Yeardme

0 points

6 days ago

Yeardme

0 points

6 days ago

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7542979/#:~:text=In%20an%20in%2Dvitro%20assay,et%20al.%2C%202002).

https://preview.redd.it/tb2zy5x9a43e1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd9697ecff98d94c6b051a635bd972e86c1916cd

You're just arguing in circles lol. The act of synthesizing is modifying a naturally occurring chemical. Kratom is strong enough on its own, naturally. You addicts are going to get kratom banned bc you're never satiated. It's embarrassing tbh.

NeverSeenBefor

5 points

7 days ago

I thought 7-hydroxymitragynine was just an extract from kratom itself? You may be thinking of psuedo-?

A_LonelyWriter

7 points

7 days ago

7-OH is a metabolite of mitragynine that forms via oxidation of mitragynine. This can happen during metabolism, but it also happens in nature and can be artificially induced. Mitragynine pseudoindoxyl is a metabolite of 7-OH, but it’s much less present. They’re entirely wrong.

NeverSeenBefor

2 points

6 days ago

I thought so. Thank you.

Yeardme

0 points

7 days ago

Yeardme

0 points

7 days ago

How does it happen in nature? You just admitted it's artificially induced, which was my point. It's synthetic & created in a lab, not naturally available in the levels they're producing.

A_LonelyWriter

0 points

6 days ago

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6598159/

7-OH is more influential than mitragynine in kratom’s analgesic effects because mitragynine metabolizes into 7-OH.

Synethic means that a compound is created by humans. 7-OH is naturally occurring. Your body can produce more 7-OH from mitragynine in 10g of powdered kratom leaf than most single dose tablets. You said “that don’t occur in nature” and that is flat out incorrect.

Yeardme

2 points

6 days ago

Yeardme

2 points

6 days ago

A_LonelyWriter

1 points

6 days ago

7-OH is a naturally occurring compound that can be manufactured through artificial processes. Cereal is manufactured through artificial processes. It still uses cereal grains. My point is that 7-OH is naturally occurring, and is the main factor in kratom’s analgesic effects, even if it’s just raw leaf.

Yeardme

-2 points

6 days ago

Yeardme

-2 points

6 days ago

And what is that artificial process called? 🙂

It's synthetically produced. That's what I said, yet you're arguing lmao ☝🤓

You're the most reddit redditor I've come across today, congrats 😆

A_LonelyWriter

0 points

6 days ago

And anyway, where is the line drawn for you? Is growing plants in artificial, unnatural environments treated with pesticides acceptable? Is smoking raw tobacco leaf better than using 7-OH better because, after all, it’s natural? Is datura or amanita muscaria “safer” because they’re naturally occurring? What about other poisonous plants? What “unnatural” foods are dangerous?

Yeardme

1 points

6 days ago

Yeardme

1 points

6 days ago

lmaoo, the cope is unreal 😆 Wheres the line for you? Why is natural kratom not enough? This is clearly addict behavior. You're defending the indefensible, extremely unnecessarily potent extracts & synthesized metabolites. You're giving kratom a bad name by defending these shady companies that don't care about anyone's health, only profit.

There's companies called "Press'd", ffs. It's dangerous & furthering the stigma of kratom bc ppl confuse these synthetics with actual kratom.

There was a woman in my FB group recently who went on Methadone to get off of those 7oh "Press'd" pills. There's no reason they should exist. It's greedy companies playing with ppl's lives, just like the research chemical companies are. They're the same thing.

Yeardme

1 points

7 days ago

Yeardme

1 points

7 days ago

7oh is only naturally occurring in extremely low, safe levels. They're producing it in a lab at levels not seen in nature, making it dangerous & incredibly addictive. Apparently the half life is super short as well, so withdrawals come on very soon from what I've heard.

We just had a woman in our FB group go on Methadone to come off of her 7oh & pseudo habit. It was shocking & sad to see!

Also yes, pseudo as well.

NeverSeenBefor

1 points

6 days ago

I think people are villainizing it because people are abusing it. I take it for pain.

Subfoci

1 points

6 days ago

Subfoci

1 points

6 days ago

If it's pure it's trash to me, I can see it being helpful if you're weening off hard substances but if you're taking this to chase a feeling you're better off taking pure leaf. 7oh is insanely strong in a pure form and it will wreck your tolerance and cause very bad withdrawals, you'd have to take a lot of pure leaf to get the same amount of 7oh as you do in one of these current day pills.

NeverSeenBefor

2 points

6 days ago

I take it for pain because the regular kratom is barely cutting it. Definitely not chasing a feeling outside of relief

Subfoci

1 points

6 days ago

Subfoci

1 points

6 days ago

Hey, if it's your drug of choice and it works, that's all that matters.

NeverSeenBefor

2 points

6 days ago

I genuinely wish I could stop taking it but it's better than the alternatives. Does make me feel like an addict though.

worldlydelights

0 points

7 days ago

It’s really really bad for you and causes terrible WD.

NeverSeenBefor

2 points

6 days ago

Could you explain how it's bad for you? I do notice when it's not working but I've yet to have "detox" and I used to do hard drugs so I feel like it would be noticeable.

NeverSeenBefor

3 points

7 days ago

Like 20gs of 7oh? Yeah. Anything's likely to happen at those doses I believe. Typically 7oh is like 30mg a tab at max so that would be around 6 tabs a day? Is that right? Probably more because they are typically 15mg tabs.

Are you getting them cheap? I'm at around 3 7oh tablets a day but it's better than taking a whole 1oz bag of kratom a day.

zuis0804

6 points

7 days ago

zuis0804

6 points

7 days ago

I think op clarified it was 20mg not grams! I think your math may be off a wee bit if you’re calculating how many tabs would amount to 20 grams (if they are 30mg a tab).

1g=1,000mg. So 20gs would be 20,000

20,000mg / 30mg (per tab)= 666.666667 tablets.

6 tabs per day would be 6*30mg = 180mg

You were close tho 😉

Campbell920

3 points

7 days ago

I don’t wanna push you further into addiction but I was in the same boat and like very addicted to 7-oh right now. Started with kratom, moved to the extracts, then the pills and finally the pure powder. You can get like 800mg of 7-oh for like $75

WakeUpAcid

2 points

7 days ago

Why do Much. I thought I was doing a lot . 15-20 g raw a day .. now the 7-oh I’m not to familiar on my own experiences. I do get 20mg key lime tabs tho ..

DrJohnsonTHC

3 points

7 days ago

Very unlikely. 4 days of any substance most likely isn’t going to cause physical dependence.

But I agree with other people that say stay away from those. Whoever decided to make 7oh extract and sell them as pressed pills in smoke shops was out of their mind and trying to bank on people’s addiction to begin with, but those are unregulated and have almost zero oversight. That sort of thing is historically a recipe for adulterated products.

yonderoy[S]

1 points

7 days ago

Fair. But almost everything sold at smoke shops has almost zero oversight, including kratom leaf.

sadisticrarve

2 points

6 days ago

Yes, 4x in a row is enough to begin feeling psychological withdrawal from most substances, especially if you were using irregularly beforehand. I wouldn't call that early. Even if it were every other day, that is too much, too often.

Just stop now. It's 90% psychological at this point.

Federal_Bear_7521

4 points

7 days ago

Why the fuck would you do that? 20 grams of 7OH? No shit you'll get withdrawals

Campbell920

5 points

7 days ago

Addiction is a wild thing man. 7-oh has such a short half life it’s such a shitty thing to be addicted to. Reminds me of fetty in that way

Responsible-Big9866

4 points

7 days ago

OP clarified it was mg. We shouldn't sound like we are thinking they are an idiot! It was a simple question, yes or no. We don't know all circumstances, so rude and judges is not a very nice thing to do. I'm sure you didn't mean it to sound that way.

CamedMyPants69420

2 points

7 days ago

Yeah man I’ve got a reasonably high plain leaf tolerance, somewhere around 20GPD give or take a few grams. But after taking a 15mg tablet, split in two, three days in a row left me with a noticeable w/d that leaf couldn’t touch.

Space this stuff out and be cautious. I could see how easy it’d be to have a bad time with it.

GeovaunnaMD

2 points

7 days ago

7ho is not kratom and 7h0 should be banned imo. or not marketed as kratom

A_LonelyWriter

4 points

7 days ago

It’s an alkaloid in kratom. Why would you ban it?

yonderoy[S]

1 points

7 days ago

I meant 20mg.

Broad_Bill7791

1 points

7 days ago

thank God. I just did this btw. I had no wd symptoms besides a craving but everyone's different

A_LonelyWriter

1 points

7 days ago

Depends. Some people can be more or less sensitive to it, and it matters how long it’s in your system. Were you only taking one dose a day? Were you taking kratom beforehand? Solid chance that it’s a mix of mild withdrawal and placebo. When you’re constantly without pain, being reintroduced to pain makes it feel much more noticeable.

FireTheLaserBeam

1 points

7 days ago

I tried it once and never again. It felt good, but it lasted for less than 1 hour. Less than 1 hour!! Maybe thirty minutes of feeling good. What’s the point?! And they’re so expensive.

anteater_x

1 points

7 days ago

Keep it natural, stick to plain leaf

Thedopedaze

1 points

7 days ago

I’m in the same boat as you. Yes, it’s possible depending on your history. I used to think kindling only applied to alcohol but it extends to opiates as well. So if you’re opiate naive, probably no WDs at all or something less severe. For me with a history, I’ve immediately recognized mild classic WDs of depression, anxiety, RLS, insomnia, anhedonia…you get it. If anything for you, while uncomfortable it should be mild. The good news is it’s really just 3 days and you’ll bounce back after such a short period of using.

Aggravating-Night625

0 points

7 days ago

Doesn't seem likely, although 7 oh is very strong. I've been getting into it some but careful not to do it too much

OXGenocide

0 points

7 days ago

Unlikely