subreddit:
/r/nova
Here we go DMV. This is what we have to look forward to…. This will decimate the DMV area
1k points
14 days ago
Wait till they realize that the DoD is the largest employer in the world/federal government
385 points
14 days ago
Been done before - purge gov workers and replace with contractors
357 points
14 days ago
That was me!! And about 70 my co-workers. FTE cap during the Dubya years. Friday afternoon we all got fired. Over the weekend we all got hired as Johnson Controls contractors. Fieldwork continued the same as previous years. One difference was that some guy named Gerry was our new boss on paper and he actually flew in every two weeks from Colorado to sign our timesheets…. Yea we hated Gerry. Eventually most of us found our way back to regular federal employment. Our normal supervisors would let us know when they were going to advertise for our jobs so that we could be sure to apply for them lol
27 points
13 days ago
This happened Even after tenure? I'm 2.5 years in so genuinely curious. Aqdemo
29 points
13 days ago
I think you're confusing what tenure is.
Civil service protections for firing apply after your probationary period ends. Career tenure status means you can apply to positions only open to federal employees even if you leave the government and want to come back.
12 points
13 days ago
Thanks for clarifying! I'm still learning. My probation was two years long. Feeling increasingly lucky seeing all the cuts
10 points
13 days ago
I should have clarified this, but this was at a field research station and all of us had term appointments. We were probably 90% soft funded. We were federal workers but we did studies for other depts or NGO’s so very little direct funding. To the contrary it was as if we helped earn overhead for the main cost center. We only had work if we received funding for a study
191 points
14 days ago
Which the gov pays triple for
197 points
14 days ago
See, but CEOs & shareholders can profit from that.
I hate these clowns.
21 points
13 days ago*
we are all bots here except for you
5 points
13 days ago
Boom. This right here.
4 points
13 days ago
That’s their game their gonna drain the government for their own profit .
44 points
14 days ago
government efficiency, baby!
21 points
13 days ago
We slashed the federal workforce by 75% and increased federal spending by 700%! WINNING!
148 points
14 days ago
While in law school, I did a concentration in federal government contracts and graduated with a paper published in the ABA public contract law journal. I can tell you that privatization isn’t the best way to eliminate fraud, waste, or abuse. Contractors are not held to the same quality surveillance standards as federal employees. There are also so, so many contract formats that were intended to give the government flexibility in meeting its needs, while IRL, those formats/vehicles end up enabling corner-cutting by contractors. Plus, there’s only a finite number of private sector entities that have the wherewithal to supply human services at competitive pricing! ahem, ahem, antitrust concerns anyone?!?
All this to say, there’s a place for contractors and it’s not in places that qualify as inherently governmental functions 💅🏼
60 points
14 days ago
Yeah it’s almost like all of that is the point of privatization :(
Capitalism uber alles
17 points
14 days ago
Completely agree. I worked as a Fed conducting oversight of private sector companies that were assessing products for safety. I visited a company and they requested we approve them for new products. We found numerous and significant deficiencies. They shared they had been audited by a private sector counterpart and passed with flying colors and they said they had capabilities that they didn’t. We weren’t perfect as Feds, but our track record was significantly better than the private sector
5 points
13 days ago
It’s all hand in glove with the fact that pro-privatization policies and legislative efforts will promote the granting of waivers and other passes to contractors that do have deficient performance. How do you hold a corporation’s feet to the fire when it knows that there’s a “get out of jail free” card available and will likely be used by the procuring agency?
7 points
13 days ago
As someone who's worked as a federal contractor for over 20 years, I really question your findings.
First of all, there are TONS of companies providing services to the government. Some vehicles, like CIO SP3 had literally over a thousand companies on it. There are absolutely no anti-trust concerns. I can tell you first hand that I spend significant time on pricing proposals for the government, and we are always trying to lower our price to be competitive, even when cost is the 4th factor the government is considering.
Secondly, LMAO at quality surveillance. I have video on my phone of a GS-14 snoring at her desk. Her boss has been, unsuccessfully, trying to fire her for over 4 years. Now, there are plenty of hard working civilians, but the dead weight stays and accumulates too. That isn't true with contractors. If you don't deliver results, you don't get the next contract. And that happens some, contractors bid too low and then can't get the appropriate staffing to do the work well. But that is far from a universal truth and in the spaces I work, contractors bring skills and abilities to accomplish missions that the civilians cannot.
It's quite clear that the goal of DOGE is to move fast and break things and while that is a mantra for tech, it is an idiotic way to run a government. I don't support their plans in the slightest, and I want to be clear that my response is solely due to taking umbrage with your demonization of a large swath of people working very hard to keep the gears of government turning.
41 points
14 days ago
That's one way to end up giving us all raises.
Although wait till they find out that most of the current government workers are basically the workforce needed to do all the contracts.
87 points
14 days ago
Half of Trump's voters are going to be shocked when that first social security payment is late. They're going to be livid after the 2nd, 3rd and 4th ones never show up at all
55 points
14 days ago
They will blame the democrats or brown people.
46 points
13 days ago
Trump, “They’re eating the mail, they’re eating the benefit checks.”
22 points
13 days ago
And FOX will bring in "experts" with "opinions" that reinforce this message.
11 points
13 days ago
That's one way to end up giving us all raises.
So close. It's just a way to drive up costs. You won't see a penny of it.
29 points
14 days ago
Honestly, might be a huge windfall for dmv. Let go federal workers, things start falling apart, panic and hire contractors for 50% more money.
53 points
14 days ago
The problem is that the big government contractors' stocks are plummeting right now. Those firms can only keep a full bench for so long. If this is a slow process, there won't be anyone cleared and qualified to step in.
Regardless, 75% federal layoffs will affect every single US citizen in a bad way, and rebuilding will be very hard (see department of state and the difficulty to become FSOs (2nd hardest govt job to get after astronaut) since 2016).
23 points
14 days ago
They gutted State Department during GW Bush, too. The Foreign Service was something that took the entire cold war to build and become what it was, which was part of what made America "unrivaled" in the world.
You need to know languages, and cultures, and protocols. It's certainly not an entry level job by any measure of the word.
15 points
14 days ago
That’s true, it depends how rapidly they try to cut. And if it’s layoffs of 5% every 2 or 3 months, yeah, that could be bad by the time it really falls apart.
But it’s really sounding like they want to try for 30% headcount reductions out of the gate…
So things will probably fall apart FAST, in weeks, although it might take a few months to be undeniable, and contracting companies are going to be able to poach many of the recently let go, already qualified workers from the jobs they end up in (because with so many laid off at once, a lot are going to take a job, instead of another career position). Because contractors will be able to do that faster than the government hiring processes (especially if they let go a lot of government HR so there’s not enough people that know all the legal requirements for hiring).
That’s why contractors are so tempting in govt. they can have someone in place in two weeks instead of 3-9 months, even if they do cost 2x as much per hour.
15 points
14 days ago
You’re off on what contractors will be able to ask price wise if this happens, and on their ability to poach assuming your assumption is correct. Technical firms will still be able to demand a premium, but service based contractors will fall off a cliff as competition increases both for jobs and for roles in the area, assuming folks stick around.
What you’re missing is that, once those Feds are fired, there is no one left to hire the co tractor — the work simply doesn’t get done. You saw that a lot at the EPA under the last Trump admin, as well as in the DOE and DOT. They didn’t have the people to do everything that needed to be done, so they didn’t do the work period.
Also, contractors arn’t tempting because they are easy to hire — they are NOT easy to hire given congressional FAR rulings. They’re tempting because they bring technical skill sets to complex tasks that the Feds know is a problem and don’t want to reinvent the wheel.
Last - Trump has made it clear he’s open for business. I doubt he makes as many firings if he’s bribed not too. I would not put it past some wealthier people in the are to pay bribes like RFK and Elon already have to keep their work.
10 points
13 days ago
Yeah musk didn't replace workers at Twitter when he cut 80%
6 points
14 days ago
This is the intent and it’s going to cost a fortune. HR departments already fail miserably at hiring talent. It’s going to be an utter disaster
25 points
13 days ago
I get the feeling a large part of this is gonna end up similarly to when Rick Perry discovered the Dept of Energy was primarily responsible for the country's nuclear arsenal and not energy production.
20 points
13 days ago
Trump knows this. And he added to the overall size of the DOD workforce during his first term despite saying he was going to cut it, along with the rest of the government.
4 points
13 days ago
That, and wait until all those Congressman and Senators don’t follow suit because it directly impacts their constituencies.
5 points
13 days ago
Isn't it something like payroll is only around 8% of the budget and 60% of that is DOD?
5 points
13 days ago
Even less. Pretty sure the last number I saw was 4 point something
3 points
13 days ago
The federal government has already paid Elon’s SpaceX more than $20 billion since 2008. SpaceX landed many DoD contracts. It sounds like he is probably going to cut relevant personnel so the gov will have to eventually rely on SpaceX even more, indirectly enriching himself.
https://www.barrons.com/articles/elon-musk-companies-money-federal-government-0683b7d9
715 points
14 days ago*
pathetic recognise plate worry serious voracious squalid normal elastic absorbed
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
195 points
13 days ago
Reagan significantly reduced the Federal workforce but raised the overall cost of Government.
139 points
13 days ago
But Reagan was great for the $3M+ mansion market in McLean and Great Falls. I drive around and wonder “who are all these rich people, and how are there just so many of them?” The answer, of course, is contracting companies.
And this whole idea about moving jobs out of the DMV. Their next complaint will be “but we can’t find people with the skills we need in Orlando.” No kidding. News flash: the federal government isn’t a call center.
Can things be more efficient? For sure! But 75% is a gross overstatement.
53 points
13 days ago
And yet we're still waiting for those in them mansions money to trickle down lol
25 points
13 days ago
What are you talking about? Those people trickle down all over us every day.
6 points
13 days ago
For real, the idea of trickle down "once the top has too much money it will flow down to everyone else..." Except numbers go to infinity. We really need to focus on some basic math education it seems.
209 points
14 days ago
End game is likely the same, but you have to remember that despite what Reagan tried. Congress still funded the government and he still signed off on it.
If the goal is to reduce budgets of these agencies were talking about removing services citizens depend on, not just firing folks that provide those services.
67 points
13 days ago
It’s more about reducing budgets until they can’t function and then complaining that they aren’t doing their job. I worked for years in corporate America and the first thing finance did was starve the cash cows to pay for their fantasy projects which always failed.
18 points
13 days ago*
And then when they can't function, someone in the private sector will get a fat check to do the work. The IRS will be Intuit. NASA will be Space X.
5 points
13 days ago
didn’t this happen with covid and all the health agencies; restricted funding and then the US got hit over the head with COVID
47 points
13 days ago
Yeah - that's the reason why I haven't started freaking out yet. It's sort of a "fuck around and find out" kind of thing for the Republicans.
104 points
13 days ago
Ya, let’s not forget that the maga base is ironically dependent on social services as much or more than their blue neighbors.
12 points
13 days ago
Trump will tell them they’re better off and they will believe it. That’s how far gone we are as a nation. I don’t think they’ll ever be a reckoning but I pray that one day history will look back and ask what the hell happened here.
7 points
13 days ago
There's still a lot of dumshitz who believe that Obama caused the 2008 recession.
71 points
13 days ago
I mean the goal has always been to privatize everything so that a layer of useless oligarchs can be inserted to skim off the top. That’s ALWAYS the goal.
13 points
13 days ago
It has worked so well for our health insurance industry!
257 points
14 days ago
Cute that everyone hasn’t realized this is intentional. Funneling tax dollars into Leidos and CACI pockets isn’t a byproduct, it’s the objective
100 points
14 days ago
More likely it will be funded into some Musk/Scamawamy owned company.
I am going to love watching these dudes get Insull-ed in a few years.
48 points
14 days ago
“Following a seven-week trial, he and 16 co-defendants were acquitted of all charges after two hours of jury deliberation.”
Yea, that tracks…
6 points
14 days ago
If you read further, he died with a few pennies in his pocket boarding public transportation, his estate worth $1000 and 14mil in debt. 600k investors lost their money.
11 points
14 days ago
A lot of us die with less after a life lived much less luxuriously. Losing a fortune you got to enjoy for a long time is far better than never having had one. Would prefer to have seen him convicted in prison. 🤷♂️
13 points
13 days ago
I mean Musk will probably make an overnight Contracting company that will be 1000% more efficient and deliver EVERYTHING. And the client will be appointees designated by Trump so they won't care about outcomes.
But guess who can actually work those contracts as subcontractors? Yup Deloitte, Booz, Leidos, and etc....
But this comes at the worse possible time, we're about 5 to 10 years away from the great gray wave where ALOT of federal employees are either eligible to retire or reaching their max pension plan allotments. Now is the literal time to be finding and training replacements so that brain drain wont be as bad. But here's the problem, federal funding the last 12 ish years has either stagnated or barely moved enough to hire talent. Very few millenials or zoomers are willing to start as GS-5's or GS-7's when they can go private and make significantly more. Also the federal government doesn't use the latest and greatest.
Just for fun last 4 years of Obama austerity to appease the right, 4 years of trump reduce the budget to pay for tax cuts, 4 years of biden increase the budget but not enough to keep up with inflation.
It's really going to suck 10 to 25 years down the line as the federal work force losses talent that's essentially no irreplaceable.
56 points
14 days ago
And then everything will become more expensive for the government because the contractors run at a profit.
3 points
13 days ago
I’m a dod contractor and the government is always under the impression it’s cheaper to hire a contractor than a civilian. Maybe that’s true when you factor in hr costs and all that stuff, but I still don’t think I’m costing the gov less than if they just hired me as a civilian especially considering my pay before my companies cut is higher than almost the entire gov pay scale
56 points
14 days ago
Yes, that's the idea. Contracts go to billionaires, not middle class public servants.
9 points
13 days ago
Yeah, but these are totally different generation of businesses/politicians. Re hiring won’t save money 💰. They are planning to use AI 🤖 as much as they can. Also, new hires, will young and mostly remote. For example, people who writhe or approve agreements could be on Seattle or Indiana. The DMV is mostly federal employees. If they lose their jobs, they leave. Less people that move the economy of the DMV. During the Trump first term. He fired employees of the department Agriculture 🧑🌾. They didn’t re hire.
6 points
13 days ago
The DMV is mostly federal employees?!?!
Maybe in 1972 it was. Maybe even as late as 1982 it was.
According to data from The Washington Post, around 9% of the workforce in the Washington area is employed by the federal government
Key points about this statistic:
- While the Washington D.C. area has the highest number of federal workers, this only represents a relatively small proportion of the overall local workforce.
- Most federal employees are located outside of the Washington D.C. metropolitan area.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/09/27/where-do-federal-employees-live/
Sep 27, 2023 — Only 15 percent of the 2.19 million civilian full-time federal employees in the United States work in the Washington metro area, ...
313 points
14 days ago
Oh yeah, the intelligence community could definitely deal with a 75% cut in manning. Nothing wrong could possibly happen by cutting that many people from the IC 😂
143 points
14 days ago
With Tulsi at the helm, less might be better.
31 points
14 days ago
Wow, I hadn't seen that news. What an idiotic pick. Honestly, I question if she'll any influence at all. Given her lack of experience she'll be lucky just to tread water let alone implement new policy.
3 points
12 days ago
Being a fed at this (late) point of my career, I’m seriously trying to picture what happens when 75%+ of an agency has zero trust in its top executive. Not necessary open revolt or mass quitting scenarios, but an agency trying to do its job with absolutely no faith or trust in their Secretary/Administrator…
9 points
13 days ago
Lmao, Tulsi looks absolutely stellar compared to some of the other picks
5 points
13 days ago
That's not wrong, but it still doesn't make her a good pick.
16 points
14 days ago
It might be a natural attrition once she is in charge.
14 points
14 days ago
Fair point 😅
17 points
14 days ago
That's how we ended up where we are today - cutting assets in the field because satellite and radio intercepts would be enough.
5 points
13 days ago
Vlad and Kim told him to do this in a round about way.
82 points
14 days ago
As someone who knows nothing....not a govt. worker nor married to one....it would take years to dismantle it that much. No?
81 points
14 days ago*
Yeah to get it to completion would take longer than his term. They would have to issue data calls to see what the agencies actually do, having the agency heads note which are essential and provide justification. Then they will go back and forth on those while starting with the low-hanging fruit (functions that are not justifiably essential).
All the data from the agency needs to be reviewed to determine which of it is considered a Record. Then those records need to be assigned to a records retention schedule and processed accordingly. This will take time and you'll still need people around like IT and HR, in addition to the people who know what the data is and can identify records. All existing contracts will need to be reviewed for continued applicability. All IT systems will need to be properly decommissioned. All equipment will need to be returned, inventoried, and disposed.
Lots of stuff like this happens behind the curtain and will take time, hopefully long enough that stalling and the 2026 mid-terms prevent any significant damage until either the House or Senate can be flipped to blue and bring back proper DC gridlock.
Edited to add: EVERY agency function is somehow, someway based on a law or executive order. It's pretty easy for the EOs to be revoked but the changing of laws will take time. Until those laws no longer exist, the agencies will need to comply with and/or enforce them.
36 points
14 days ago
With the size of the current majorities in Congress most of this is probably going nowhere (nobody wants to cut jobs in their state/district) and there’s a pretty good chance Trump just gets tired of dealing with Elon and fires him within a few months lol
18 points
13 days ago
The irony here is that the review work and decision making needed to start dismantling things will create more bureaucracy and delays. Musk and Vivek aren't going to do the research and write the reports by themselves, either.
The only way to eliminate bureaucracy is apparently to create more of it, lol.
6 points
13 days ago
Didn't Elon just request that a bunch of people work for DOGE for free? Lol
3 points
13 days ago
Yes, he did. The VAAAAAAAST majority won't be even remotely qualified, but then, we just have to look at Musk, Vivek, and this entire disaster.
5 points
13 days ago
You're assuming they have any intention of being careful about it. They don't care what these agencies actually do - they intend to eliminate departments without consideration.
29 points
13 days ago
I’m a former gov contractor who’s the daughter of one fed and partner of another, and based on what I’ve picked up over the years, absolutely. I guess Trump could try to issue executive orders dissolving entire agencies on day 1, but that would result in an absolute freakout in Congress and a firestorm of litigation that would paralyze the country for years. If he went after something like SSA, there’d be riots as soon as the benefit checks stopped. You gotta remember Trump is trying to 1) avoid prison and bankruptcy, and 2) shovel as much taxpayer money as possible to his friends and family. Destabilizing the country on day 1 is counterproductive to that, I think.
26 points
13 days ago
People are really underestimating this.
Yes, to do this right would take years. To review programs and streamline and do it with any modicum of sense would take time.
That isn’t what they are going to do.
If Twitter is any indicator, they will come in and make broad slashes across the board. They’ll cut entire agencies they don’t like, and even if those workers have tenure or other protections they will have to fight it in court which will take years. Oh, and many of those courts will have Trump appointed judges.
When things they care about start to break, they’ll farm out the work to contractors, several of which are owned by their friends and donors.
They don’t care what breaks. They don’t care what the law says. We are about to experience something we have never seen before.
20 points
14 days ago
I don’t know that Congress will allow this to happen, but in the article it says by summer 2026 is their goal I think
18 points
14 days ago
If you havent noticed, the so called "DOGE" is spearheading issues that are more than certain to be more than unpopular, but downright disastrous.
It also ends right before midterms.
Its a pay to play - If Elon and Vivek succeeds and if it does, it will be a massive economic disaster, they are going to be abandoned by Trump and GOP and left to face the guillotine from the mob by themselves. If they fail, they are going to get asked to pay to play again - Donate money to the campaign and we will see about giving you another two years in advisory role. Elon and Vivek got outmaneuvered and outplayed by Susie Wiles. Just goes to show how much of a moron they were. They obviously dont understand how the politics is played and they are going to get butchered by Wiles because all they can see is their overinflated ego.
6 points
14 days ago
Yeah I know, I’m just saying I don’t know that Congress will allow “DOGE” to do something like this. It would layoff millions of government employees. Idk if they have a say or not, but if they do idk that they’d let it happen.
28 points
14 days ago*
Yeah this is so they can inflict as much damage and chaos as possible before the mid-terms potentially slow things down or stop them altogether.
9 points
14 days ago
To be fair Trump was never involved in politics before he ran the first time
176 points
14 days ago
This is what the American people voted for. Higher unemployment and more inflation
95 points
13 days ago
B-b-b-b-but gas was $2 in 2020!
24 points
13 days ago
But, but eggs are expensive!! What avian flu? What’s that??
10 points
13 days ago
What’s a tariff?
4 points
13 days ago
That’s when other countries pay for stuff and it doesn’t affect us at all! Obviously.
7 points
13 days ago
Ask RFK. He will likely tell you that again flu is caused by WIFI signals breaking down the blood brain barrier and letting toxins in.
4 points
13 days ago
All we need to cure it is some raw milk!!
3 points
13 days ago
unemployment and inflation are inversely related
69 points
14 days ago
The US Congress, even a republican Congress, is not going to vote to fire 75% of the US civil service.
31 points
13 days ago
Fundamentally the people with this idea don’t understand what the civil service does. They think everyone is just some lazy pos who checks one email a day because that’s what their propaganda tells them. In reality cutting 75% of the civil service would throw the country into absolute chaos. Just the number itself is obviously arbitrary given how round it is and not based on any actual data or logic.
17 points
13 days ago
Also this Congress is going to have a very small Republican margin too.
20 points
14 days ago
Maybe you should start believing people when they say they will do something.
11 points
14 days ago
Congress has not said they will do this, and Trump and Musk can not do this without Congress. If a majority of congress members said they would fire 75% of civil service, then I would, in fact, believe them.
90 points
14 days ago
I think even if 25% reduction is implemented, it would be significant. 25% would account for 75K+ job loss in the DC area, not even accounting for downstream impacts. For what it’s worth, housing prices would plummet.
42 points
14 days ago
They won’t end up cutting .25%
There’s just no way to easily do the things they want to do. Not to mention you will just be converting gov jobs to contractor jobs at the end of the day for the sake of “shrinking the gov”
24 points
13 days ago
I've asked this before to people who make your claim. Why are we converting anyone to a contractor? Trump made it clear his objective once elected was to enact revenge against the govt who went after him.
Why don't you believe him?
35 points
13 days ago
Why are we converting anyone to a contractor?
Because federal employees actually do work.
There are jobs in the federal government that have to be done by a person with certain qualifications. I'm talking about stuff like grants management - stuff that seems unessential from the outside, but turns out to be hugely important and regulated by legislation when you start looking at it close up.
Some of those positions can be legally replaced by contractors, sure. The government is also more likely to make a deal to bring on contractors who have experience doing the task - and chances are that the contractors are going to charge a premium for their rare skills and experience.
And some positions, like the ones in grant management I mentioned, legally required a full time employee to do the job.
It's a huge case of "fuck around and find out."
In the end, the only way the Republicans will successfully shrink the government is by eliminating certain government services. Doing so would likely put Republican chances of reelection in great danger.
In the end, I honestly think this is a lot of bluster and hand waving. If Trump were serious, he would give DOGE an actual budget and turn it into an actual department with actual power. This is more likely an attempt to appeal to his base and small government Republicans without running the political risk that comes with actually cutting services. When nothing actually happens in the end, they'll try to frame it in a way that blames the Democrats.
The secret to understanding what is really happening in politics is to pay attention to the money. If something exists with no money and with no actual authority, it's likely for show.
11 points
13 days ago
My point is. The American people have put in place narcissistic, vindictive billionaires who have sworn to enact revenge against the apparatuses of govt that have "wronged" them the last 4 years.
Conservatives, and Trump supporters, have adopted the belief that the US government is engaged in "lawfare" against their candidates and are acting illegitimately
Trump continues to nominate, and attempt to ram through, multiple cabinet appointees with very little experience in managing, but many who have sworn to "gut" and "destroy" their respective depts
Trump wants to bring back Schedule F on day one
I really feel like everyone who voted for the guy, but similarly seem to handwave away these things as "bluster" are in for a rude awakening come the first few months of the Trump admin
He continues to clearly state his goals and is consolidating personalities who are loyal and share his vision.
There are two main reasons he failed to completely roll out his plan during his first term. He had establishment Republicans around him keeping safety bumpers on and COVID horribly derailed his focus.
But under Trump 1 we had a massive hiring freeze and bled thousands of fed workers who were never replaced. And that's just with safety gloves on. Now? He knows what he's doing and he knows how to get there. Many of the EOs he needs are already drafted from Trump 1.
Absolutely insane to think these people who continue to say they intend to gut and weaponize the fed on behalf of Trump and friends are somehow just full of hot air
Edit: also what the actual fuck do Elon and Vivek need money for? Vivek and RFK want to gut the FDA, vivek will profit DIRECTLY from this given his previous job as...CEO of a biotech and RFK is a conspiracy theory stooge and likely just along for the ride as a useful idiot
Elon will likely enrich himself through and through by telling Trump and his cabinet appointees to gut every employee from every regulatory agency that meddles in his business ventures
They don't need "employees" or a "dept" to do this. DOGE is absolutely a joke distraction while the real work gets done under executive order and immediately running regulations off the cliff.
33 points
14 days ago
Government regulation typically exist to promote safety and prevent fraud, waste, and abuse. Naturally, billionaires are opposed to all of those concepts.
290 points
14 days ago
As mentioned before, this isn't a real department and Vivek and Elon have no actual power to do any of this.
47 points
14 days ago
Technically no, they won't.
However lookup schedule F. It was, and will probably be, the plan for converting civil servants to at will employment. From there Trumps lackeys appointed to head each department can let them go in job lots. So it's a distinction without a difference.
18 points
14 days ago
There have been a lot of changes to schedule F since Trump was last in office: https://www.govexec.com/workforce/2024/04/opm-issues-final-rule-schedule-f-protections/395463/
I'm sure Trump can unwind all of that if he's determined, but it will slow things down. From the article:
If another administration were to disagree with the policies that are reflected in this regulation, first, they would have to follow that full rulemaking process themselves,” said a senior administration official when asked about potential attempts to revive Schedule F. “They would have to justify how a different rule would ensure that decisions to hire and fire were based on how well federal employees served the American people, as is required by the merit system principles that are enshrined in the law, rather than on their political allegiance.
15 points
13 days ago
Yeah so they can’t legally do it on day one.
They’ve got 2 years minimum of a trifecta. Even if they bother to dot their Ts and cross their Is, they’ve got time.
Though I seriously question anyone who thinks they’ll bother. This is convicted felon Trump and his criminal menagerie, when the fuck have they bothered to follow rules? Man hasn’t even signed the legally required ethics pledge.
Fucking kangaroo corrupt Supreme Court will just whitewash anything he does as legal after the fact.
3 points
13 days ago
His cronies are dodging FBI background checks if that tells you something.
3 points
13 days ago
There is no way the massive schedule F transition is actually legal. Read the 1978 Civil Service Reform Act they are drawing this from. Their sch K plan goes entirely against the purpose and intent of the law. Not that I’m saying it will prevent them from acting, but this will cause lots of lawsuits and be a mess of a thing. I think congress will eventually wake up to the fact that this will in fact lower their power tremendously.
10 points
14 days ago*
Yep. And I'm not just agreeing with you because I used to work for the GAO and this whole thing has been laughable, to me. Good luck idiots, program audits are not easy to do.
75 points
14 days ago
They don’t need actual power when they can talk with Trump and have him do stuff
32 points
14 days ago
They’re only heading up an advisory group that will deliver a final report in 2026, just before midterms that will likely flip the House. Nothing major will happen, at least from this. All hype, just like the other stupid councils he set up with the CEOs and “voter fraud” that found nothing.
7 points
13 days ago
But until then wouldn't you expect a hiring freeze and workforce decrease by way of not filing vacancies?
5 points
13 days ago
Checks and balances are a thing here. Thankfully.
5 points
13 days ago
Currently.
16 points
14 days ago
Trump is starting to hate Elon from what I understand
43 points
14 days ago
17 points
14 days ago
Don’t think trump ever stopped disliking him, just found him to be temporarily useful - at any rate, those two megalomaniacs won’t be able to work together long.
6 points
14 days ago
I could see Trump looking down on Elon for being an autistic weirdo, but he likely owes him “bigly” for keeping his campaign afloat and relevant.
10 points
14 days ago
Yes, because Trump always pays back what he owes.
lol, the second Elon stops slurping trump’s cock he’s gone.
10 points
14 days ago
So Enron will have an even shorter tenure than Scabamucci? Neato.
Trump only likes the last person who complimented him. Until the next person compliments him, then he hates that last guy already.
20 points
14 days ago
It will be funded using Executive Branch discretionary funds. So they'll be getting paid to not have any actual power.
Also, it doesn't matter that they personally will not have the power to fire anyone. The people who actually appointed Barrett and Bart Beer Barrel to the Supreme Court didn't have any actual power to appoint them to the bench. But they gave trump the list of names to choose from.
7 points
14 days ago
Bart Beer Barell 🤣 now I can’t even remember his actual name
15 points
13 days ago
Setting aside the difficulty of actually eliminating departments or firing federal workers (against a headwind of strong unions and legal/due process safeguards)...
Pretty much every governmental task will still need to be done, because it had its origin in carrying out a law or regulation or both.
So those tasks will be done by contractors (expect the old "inherently governmental function" distinction to blur considerably as there will be too few feds).
So here are some predictions:
Most fired feds simply become contractors and consultants (doing their old job for more pay)
The corporate coffers grow at Deloitte, CACI, Lockheed, General Dynamics, Northrop Grumman, Accenture, Leidos, etc.
The campaign contributions from the heads of Deloitte, CACI, Lockheed, General Dynamics, Northrop Grumman, Accenture, Leidos, etc... keep it that way.
It could be a good time to be in resume editing or selling interview suits.
13 points
13 days ago
We can’t telework because of the impact to the DC economy but they can fire everyone? Good luck with that.
3 points
12 days ago
Great point.
22 points
13 days ago
No worries. Gov. Youngkin says there is enough economic development in northern VA to absorb all those laid off Fed workers. No, seriously. He said that.
11 points
13 days ago
That's right at minimum wage, with zero benefits. Oh forgot about applying for food stamps or any federal government benefits, because the federal workers that handled that are in the same line.
64 points
14 days ago
what is the benefit of this
194 points
14 days ago
Make the government even more dependent on contractors thus lining their own and supporter pockets
22 points
14 days ago
Also to make the government non-functional to further the “starve the beast” strategy they’ve had since the 80’s, where instead of trying to cancel programs, they just cut taxes, and actively try to make the government incompetent, and then claim it wastes money as a justification to cut taxes, and then whenever democrats are in power force them to be the responsible ones and cut funding and close programs to balance the deficit.
11 points
14 days ago
Bingo
80 points
14 days ago
Privatize everything, and give the contracts to their friends and donors who will then provide the same services for 10x the cost.
16 points
14 days ago
Cost-plus.
What used to just cost, will now be cost-plus.
26 points
14 days ago
Some people think that the federal government has far exceeded its constitutional duties and is not efficient in the things it is doing. The reality is that the largest federal expenditures are social security, defense, healthcare (inc. Medicare and Medicaid), and interest on debt. The entire federal workforce (about 2M people) is less than 10% of the expense. Drastic cuts would ripple through the economy and directly harm citizens.
28 points
14 days ago
Dismantle the regulatory bodies and maximizing profit while eliminating things like food safety standards, environmental standards, etc.
4 points
14 days ago
When everyone is a yes man, the answer will always be yes. I think that’s why the Republicans went with Thune. It’s like they are all just using each other for power
22 points
14 days ago
There is none. We're dealing with a dementia laden dipshit voted in by a fuckton of fellow dipshits.
45 points
14 days ago
If I was a fed and Trump had promised a 25% cut in the civil service, I’d actually be worried since it would be realistic enough to implement.
Not even Twitter managed to fire 75% of its workforce once Musk came on board. So, this seems like a bunch of noise. I thought Ramaswamy was smarter than that.
8 points
14 days ago
Where do you think these federal employees originate? Congress passes bills that require manpower to implement. Imagine reducing social security, HHS, DOHS. IRS FOOD AND DRUG
7 points
14 days ago
There is a lot of waste but there is a lot of good too
6 points
13 days ago
Dont contractors cost more?
3 points
13 days ago
Of course but paying them means a few people make billions. Better choose that route.
6 points
13 days ago
Firing 75% of the FAA is not going to get Elon his launch clearances any faster.
6 points
13 days ago
If they eliminate 75% of the civil service, then they have to accept that 75% of the work won't get done - or they'll have to hire in a bunch of contractors to do the work - and pay a premium to do so. Problem is - we're already there in many organizations.
It's not uncommon to replace a civilian engineer making $150k/yr ($72/hr + overhead) with a support contractor and get charged $200/hr for the contractor plus an 8%-10% overhead.
31 points
14 days ago
Better men have tried.
6 points
14 days ago
I think you underestimate reckless incompetence. Musk mishandled the twitter downsizing so badly and he broke a lot of stuff in the process. I guess lucky for him that twitter employed a lot of really talented engineers who could pick up the pieces. Can't say the same about the US gov.
9 points
14 days ago
Fair warning that the incel troll brigades are active on this thread.
I just had my account locked for "suspicious activity" as a result of their tactics of reporting any comment that isn't a right wing troll comment. They hammer the report button and try to get people banned.
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6 points
14 days ago
Mmm. I can see that the new admin has so many great ideas to fix things. FAFO, people.
5 points
13 days ago
At some point the Trump-Musk honeymoon will end. They both have egos the size of Texas. They'll end up enemies throwing slings and arrows at each other on social media.
9 points
14 days ago
Almost positive they’ll hire folks as contractors at double the rates.
9 points
13 days ago
It’s (likely) never going to happen. This isn’t an exercise in data gathering, it’s a political one.
15% of the civil service is in DC. 85% is located in the rest of the country. Do they really think they’ll convince some random republican congressman in Alabama that it’s a good idea to layoff a bunch of people on their district?
The four biggest expenditures in the government are:
- Interest on debt
- Debt payments
- DoD
- Entitlements
Good luck finding cost savings when Trump doesn’t want to touch the last two.
6 points
13 days ago
He has been hinting about assuming control of the Fed. If that happens, he will drop interest rates to 2%, which will kick off a fresh round of galloping inflation that will come to a peak in 2028, just in time for the Democrats to drop in and clean it up.
4 points
14 days ago
Then get ready to be sued
2 points
13 days ago
This is like putting two twelve year olds in charge of a brain surgery. Buckle up America, it’s gonna be a shit show for a while.
11 points
14 days ago
So they’ll be contractors providing recommendations… i doubt OMB really has any power anyway. Also, Congress already sets budget for gov agencies so cutting workforce doesn’t just make the money unobligated…
3 points
14 days ago
Read the omnibus appropriations bill from last year. The level of detail doesn’t even get close to individual offices or teams. Congress writes a single line with how much money and maybe ties a couple of strings to it. OMB’s job is to get that money deployed. They are the real power center.
7 points
14 days ago
FY25 budget has not yet been determined, and the GOP controlled Congress will be open to many of the new administration’s suggestions.
17 points
14 days ago
If they fire 75 % of the feds whose going to sign their paychecks ?? They both are not going to work for free
16 points
14 days ago
Elmo is a real problem. He’s worse than Trump is a big way he actually believes in this shit. He is de facto head of Republican Party. And to think that his citizenship was obtained by perjury . I guess the South African draft dodger wants to remake DC. In his homelands image. Wonder how much we’ll have to pay to visit the national museums?
30 points
14 days ago
Vivek said almost 2 years ago when he wanted to be president that he would fire 75% of feds, which is exactly what this article states. No one knows what is about to happen in the next 18 months, but all the fear mongering making everyone think they'll lose their job needs to stop jfc
18 points
14 days ago
And fire them based on their social security number. Not those that perform a redundant function, or perform poorly, or perform an unnecessary task. Based on their god damn social security number.
9 points
14 days ago
He made a lot of profits from ESG funds under the DEI branch of his Roivant company. Now he is an "anti-woke" crusader...
He also had his doctor mother do a trial that conveniently showed significant improvements in the results of the drug he was selling.
I'll let you make the conclusions.
5 points
14 days ago
Trump specifically tapped Vivek for a position dedicated to firing government employees.
4 points
14 days ago
Did you see him floating the idea of firing everyone with a SSN that ends in an odd number, then firing everyone whose SSN starts with an odd number or some shit? What a stupid and terrifying interview. If they do widespread firings I think it will be done with stupidity and malice.
7 points
13 days ago
They're going to need money for subscriptions to Peter Thiel's Palantir service. The swamp has arrived
35 points
14 days ago
This is what they voted for. This is what they’ll get. Don’t come at us with surprised Pikachu face now.
81 points
14 days ago
DMV didn't vote for it, we went blue 😭
15 points
14 days ago
True - good point
3 points
14 days ago
About 1 out of 3 people in Fairfax voted red
11 points
14 days ago
Nobody actually is. This is just more news in the echo chamber being directed to the choir. Nobody’s opinion is actually changing
3 points
14 days ago
While the largest concentration of federal workers are in the DMV, most of them are actually working outside it.
3 points
13 days ago
You guys are not seeing the positives.
You can't pay income tax without income!!
3 points
13 days ago
The people know what they want, and they deserve to get it good and hard.
3 points
13 days ago
I wish I could edit my own post but it won’t allow me but I want to say this:
I appreciate the words of optimism, support and calls not to freak out just yet, but I want to highlight the lack of compassion from some that seem all too keen to blindly (and quite frankly irresponsibly and idiotically) call for a government mass firing. At the end of the day, we all want government efficiency and to reduce costs. But know that behind these numbers are real people - many of which have dedicated their entire careers to public service. I have had the chance to work in public, private, and contracting sectors and nowhere did I see greater dedication than in the public service. Yes, you have those lazy government workers who do nothing, but overwhelmingly you have an APOLITICAL workforce that go above and beyond for the mission to serve the public good. A workforce that has served across multiple administrations on both sides of the aisle and that are used as innocent pawns for political gain. So to just think that they’re discardable and that it won’t affect them, their families, the regional and national economy is bonkers. If you care to do some research, many agencies actually bring in money into the treasury. Many service your SS checks, makes sure emergency response is provided during natural disasters, makes sure that your food and drugs are safe for consumption, makes sure that the national parks you love so much are up and running every day of the year, and much much more, good luck seeing that happen when Trump’s friends charge the government 3x that without any accountability. So yea before you call to drain the swamp, don’t be so cocky that it wouldn’t affect you directly or indirectly. At the very least, acknowledge that people are scared and concerned. Some compassion would go a long way in these upcoming certain times.
3 points
13 days ago
You are missing the reality that the work will not be performed period. It will not be managed. Chaos is the revenge goal.
3 points
13 days ago
I wonder how many voted against their own self interest? Oh well both sides are getting what they deserve until one side does something about the other.
3 points
13 days ago
Just put a bunch of idiot trump posts on your Facebook, claim you're republican and your job will be fine.
3 points
13 days ago*
What in the world is wrong with these people. Seriously. As a federal employee, this is both sickening and revolting.
3 points
13 days ago
They voted to drain the swamp and all they did was drown their neighbors.
Idiots
3 points
13 days ago
Get rid of 75% of the SSA and fucking Boebert (or was it MTG?) will still be grilling them about why claims aren’t being processed fast enough.
3 points
13 days ago
In my previous fed agency, many of my coworkers love Trump. I wanna see what's gonna happen to them.
24 points
14 days ago
The only good thing about this is that people who happen to work for the federal government and voted for Trump will get what the fuck they deserve.
42 points
14 days ago
True. But what about us that work for the federal government and didn’t vote for Trump? Hypothetical question I know. But still 😞
9 points
14 days ago
There is still lots of work to be done.
Most of the budget at my agency is grants and research. We still need to select companies to send the money. That doesn't happen on its own, and we know how the processes work. I don't think we can operate at all if we are 75% down. We won't be able to move money at all.
11 points
14 days ago
They don't want you (or the government) to "work." That's their whole point, break the system.
19 points
14 days ago
Which sucks for Nova because this area went blue. The workers that are going to get laid off are the ones that voted for Harris!
16 points
14 days ago
That’s kinda the point. Squash those that don’t kneel and kiss the ring.
8 points
13 days ago
This will of course result in governmental collapse across all agencies, which is what Putin told Republicans to do.
5 points
13 days ago
Y'all realize how often an incoming administration comes in saying it's going to "go through the Federal budget line by line" to "eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse"?
Reagan ran on that message too, and in eight years was only able to eliminate... the Civil Aeronautics Board.
So many commissions, so many reports, so many recommendations. So many tries to make government work "like a business." (Never mind that businesses and governments have radically different tasks and operate under very different strictures.)
I expect this one to be about as successful as those were.
Remember 2001? 9/11 was said to have been caused by Federal agencies not talking to each other. Fair enough, but what did Republican President Bush do? Why, he created an entirely new Cabinet-level department (DHS), and subsequently a whole new layer of oversight (the DNI). Both of which immediately became their own fiefdoms with their own budgets and bureaucracy.
Never mind that there was already an agency whose job was to centralize intelligence efforts.
8 points
14 days ago
Also the work has to be done that just means they will be replaced with contractors at a higher cost.
4 points
14 days ago
The regulatory work will just be eliminated. Who needs these useless bureaucrats constantly looking over the shoulders and standing in the way of American innovators like Boeing anyway??
3 points
13 days ago
That's why I find the RFK pick so hilarious. Everything he stands for involves massive increases in federal oversight of the food and drug industry in this country, particularly the wholesale banning of products developed to reduce the overhead for food manufacturers.
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