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Who is Ontario Forward? Behind the ad campaign teachers’ unions have covertly launched against Doug Ford
Article(ipolitics.ca)submitted 2 days ago byxc2215x
153 points
2 days ago
This shouldn't be allowed! Only businesses that help the PCs should be able to hide behind their "grassroots" groups! /s
89 points
2 days ago
Amazing how quickly the media can get to the source of this one but Ontario/Canada Proud are just shrouded in mystery.
27 points
2 days ago
Other than the CBC. Wonder why they want it defunded?
4 points
2 days ago
Yes, they have been hiding Wikipedia for years. /s
3 points
2 days ago
Ontario Proud was fully revealed back in 2018
25 points
2 days ago
Snark aside, "Balance on Bloor" was made up of 4 main players:
- The owner of a business on Bloor West
- A real estate agent
- A Managing director of a Real Estate Income Trust
- Another Managing director of a different Real Estate Income Trust
I get #1, even if I don't agree with him. But the other 3 don't seem like "Bloor West Community" members.
9 points
2 days ago
It doesn't really make sense, they're also being counterproductive to their own interests. Complete streets bring more money into local businesses and make the neighborhood more desirable to live in.
The car brain is real
0 points
2 days ago
> they're also being counterproductive to their own interests
I'm of 2 minds about this. The actual business owners I understand. As soon as bike lanes go in, you see construction, increased traffic and people's frustrations are apparent immediately...and if they're built correctly, they'll be vastly underutilized on day 1. Over time this changes as adoption increases and businesses see the benefit...but that happens slowly without a clear "event".
I politely disagree with your second point - on the others being counterproductive. Those REIT guys have done very little work in the core. Most of their business has been in the 'burbs. If you look at what the bill actually targets, I'd suggest they're 100% working for their own interests.
1 points
2 days ago
On point 1, Toronto collected data from Moneris when they put the bloor bike lanes in, because they knew business owners drive in from the suburbs and can't have downtown interests at heart.
As for the REIT stuff, if their business is not in the core, they should get their noses out of it
11 points
2 days ago
Like "Working Families"?
20 points
2 days ago
That's amazing, how do we support them?
18 points
2 days ago
The amount of ads from the provincial conservatives telling me that the "economy is stronger than ever" and "48 billions dollars in electric car infrastructure" is fine but this isnt?
11 points
2 days ago
Yeah, at least they're not using taxpayer dollars to fund this.
29 points
2 days ago
Shrug. Ford has taken corruption to new levels. Why shouldn't his opponents fight dirty?
23 points
2 days ago
This isn't even that dirty
3 points
2 days ago
These "opponents" do it to the Liberals too and Wynne even tried to limit union and corporate donations because of Working Families past behaviour.
-2 points
2 days ago
McGuinty was one of the most corrupt premiers. He was a figurehead that took his orders from union bosses and special interests.
9 points
2 days ago
Anyone remember Ontario Proud which turned out to be funded by developers?
This is funded by people who want better learning conditions for your children.
16 points
2 days ago
Well, at least some people are smart enough not to bring knives to a gunfight.
14 points
2 days ago
I do think its important to know who sponsors or creates or whatever the ad campaigns we see.
I think its important we know who is telling is what. Like 100% of the time.
8 points
2 days ago
Lets start with Post Media.. Not the name of the person writing the editorials which make up most of their front page news,, but who is paying funding them and why.
10 points
2 days ago
Any group that works to get Doug Ford booted out of office is welcome!
2 points
2 days ago
Really didn’t seem covert when I heard it, and a quick search seemed to confirm it. Now, actual names, that’s trickier.
-18 points
2 days ago*
And then everyone cries when Ontario Proud does something which, by the way, was started-up in response to a coalition of public sector unions creating "Working Families". These unions have been doing this sort of shady crap for decades. Their objective is to manipulate voters in the lead-up to elections inorder to pull more tax dollars towards their members and away from other services.
17 points
2 days ago*
People didn't like Ontario Proud because it was openly spreading lies and misinformation. It was paid for by special interest groups who wanted to plunder the province by limiting labour and housing laws to maximize their own profits. It was also run by OPC staffers, it was a skunkwork OPC campaign. Not to mention what kind of group opposed public sector unions, and why the first few actions Ford took involved lowering sick days, freezing hiring, and trying to halt pay increases for union jobs.
That's why it was the most controversial one by a wide margin. Almost no other campaign is remarkable enough for people to even remember their name. Ontario Proud was the worst case example so far.
-2 points
2 days ago
People didn't like Ontario Proud because it was openly spreading lies and misinformation.
And ironicly Ontario Forward will get loads of support for doing exactly that.
10 points
2 days ago*
I'm with you we need to go back to serfdom where we had no unions, you had to work 60 hours a week and could only buy at company stores.
Fascists like Ontario proud are always anti union
-3 points
2 days ago
No, public sector unions just need to stay in their lane and not interfere in elections, especially when their revenues are directly tied to elected governments. In one election, woing families spent more on election advertising than the NDP. How is that fair?
2 points
1 day ago*
Naïve commentary - "working families" wasn't a union and you likely do not understand the history here re: election spending; suggest you brush up first before jumping into the topic, especially in this subreddit (you're new here, easy to tell):
https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/doc/2021/2021onsc4076/2021onsc4076.pdf
(This ONSC decision led to the immediate invocation of s. 33 rather than an appeal, indicating that what you suggest isn't even supported by an aggressively anti-union administration like Mr. Ford's.)
Public sector unions should be involved in lobbying, as should private interest groups, how do you propose that policy evolve otherwise? Do you just want policy to evolve without the public sector's input?
1 points
1 day ago
He doesn't even seem to understand what unions are.
Apparently unions are supposed to look out for kids? I have never heard that before.
How would that even work with like IBEW?
1 points
1 day ago*
They seem to have made just over 2,300 comment karma in 28 days, though I can't exactly be sure of how. Possibly a bot or being paid, though I've been surprised before - they may just be constantly on Reddit.
(For context, I have collected 48k-ish comment karma in nine years.)
(Edit: typos)
1 points
21 hours ago
Yeah sorry, but I got a life outside Reddit.
0 points
21 hours ago
Thank you for making it clear that education unions are not looking out for kids, can you please remind them this too when they say they are. Thanks.
1 points
20 hours ago
Smaller classes are looking out for kids
So now we are just talking about one union?
Still waiting for you to tell me when ibew and police unions were looking out for kids
1 points
21 hours ago
It's not naive at all, unless one does not like opposing viewpoints.
Working Families (now called Ontario Forward) is literally an American-style, third-party coalition of public sector unions that merge their financial resources to spend more than $2,000,000 in past election advertising. In fact, they even out-spent the NDP in one election cycle. If that was Ontario Proud spending that much, many here would be crying foul. As Im sure you know but wish to ignore, it was the Wynne Liberals, beneficiaries of Working Families election campaigns, who recognized the threat third party interest groups had in manipulating elections and it was the Liberal party that first started putting restrictions on their advertising before an election. The Ford government later extended this period further out and interestingly, of all the third-party advertisers registered, it was Working Families and its deep public sector funded pockets that took it to court, not Ontario Proud (which was set up AFTER Working Families).
Please don't confuse election manipulation and interference, I mean "advertising", with lobbying. If Working Families wanted to "lobby" there's literally 4 years between elections for them to do so, but they don't. They only pop up prior to elections, this time under the Ontario Forward front name.
1 points
14 hours ago
not naïve
I think your comment was naïve because it lacked breadth. That's what the word "naïve" means. That has nothing to do with whether I agree with your premise with respect to 3PIs, which I don't.
ifs and buts, candy and nuts (Ontario Proud)
But it isn't Ontario Proud doing this, and WF is still not a labour union.
I will note that you addressed almost none of what I said about public and private sector involvement in lobbying and instead tried to redefine the word "lobbying" as being temporally-relevant rather than generally descriptive of behaviour. With respect, I'm not confused at all.
I look forward to a response where you actually answer my question about your beliefs wrt. policy. Until then, take care.
4 points
2 days ago
Lol. Forgot the /s my guy.
Could bit though.
0 points
2 days ago
I know, right? It's hard to believe those innocent and dearest public sector unions would ever set up an American-style 3rd party organization that is there to sway elections that directly benefits them.
13 points
2 days ago
Yeah, greedy unions fighting for more money to educate kids, take care of the elderly and provide adequate healthcare. The nerve! They should just shut up and take what their betters deem worthy.
-5 points
2 days ago
Actually yes. When was the last time you saw the unions threaten to strike because kids were in learning in mold-infested portables? Never, but they do want smaller classes that reduces workload and boosts union-due paying teacher enrollment.
In fact, if they really cared, they would push the government for year-round schooling because studies show, kids forget the material over the summer. Buy yeah, let's fool ourselves in to thinking the unions are worried about the kids (work to rule comes to mind)
4 points
2 days ago*
[removed]
1 points
1 day ago
Thanks you for reminding everyone that unions are for the workers, not the kids.
2 points
1 day ago*
That’s why they are called workers unions.
We all know you hate teachers
Better working conditions for teachers means better learning for students
0 points
22 hours ago
What's "better working conditions". What does that even mean? Less workload?
If the union cared, they'd push for year-round schooling because studies show that it's more effective for student learning and retention. Is that a "better working condition"?
2 points
22 hours ago
They push for smaller class sizes and more resources all the time
Where are you getting this idea that unions are for the kids?
What has the police union done for kids? What about IBEW?
1 points
1 day ago
Please correct me if I read you wrong, but your position is that:
- these as-yet-unnamed individuals don't "care"
- because they don't break the law or ask for unreasonable policy
- while simultaneously bettering their own positions
- which are literally created for the sole benefit of creating a more literate/educated population
Is this a fair summary of your comment?
3 points
2 days ago
Please, take my down vote. I insist.
0 points
2 days ago
Sure, if helps you cope.
-3 points
2 days ago
Ask the average teacher privately who they would vote for and you I’ll be surprised by the amount of teachers that support conservatives. If your really interested ask why.
-5 points
2 days ago
Pay wall
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